Rail Devolution: London

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Clinton-Davis

Tuesday 20th December 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

On the second part of the noble Baroness’s question, we saw recently other parts of the wider network benefit from Oyster. The rollout of Oyster to Gatwick is a good example of that. On the earlier part of the question, the business case also surrounded long-term investment in the infrastructure required. Certainly there, the business case fell quite short. On the issue of London Overground, yes it is run well but let us not forget that the Government still provide £27 million of funding to that particular service.

[Lord Clinton-Davis (Lab)]

Is not the reality that the Secretary of State for Transport is more anxious to prolong the dispute than to find a solution?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I believe that the noble Lord is referring to a separate franchise—that of Southern. I have already spoken on that matter, where we are moving forward in practical terms in trying to address some of the issues. As noble Lords know all too well, the point remains that the structural issues on the Southern network cannot be addressed as long as we see this level of unprecedented and, in my view, unnecessary strikes currently taking place.

Airport Capacity

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Clinton-Davis

Tuesday 25th October 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I thank my noble friend for his consistent promotion of the importance of south-east airport capacity. He can also take some comfort and credit in that his persistence has today delivered. It is an important step forward now that the Government have given a commitment to a specific scheme.

On my noble friend’s questions, it is now for Gatwick to decide. It has obviously accepted the decision that has been taken. As I have already said, I have visited Gatwick with my right honourable friend the Transport Secretary. We were impressed by its proposals and we will continue to work with Gatwick to ensure that it is very much part and parcel of our offering.

In terms of the overall airport offering for the UK and Heathrow, I agree with my noble friend. I wish to see London Heathrow, the south-east and the United Kingdom recognised throughout the world for its international connectivity which we are blessed with through our geographical location. However, we are now taking the decision to ensure we can provide that connectivity at a global level.

[Lord Clinton-Davis (Lab)]

My preference is that Gatwick and Heathrow should both be expanded, but this decision is really about Heathrow. Although it has been provisionally selected, we still have to wait, and there is considerable uncertainty about the future. Meanwhile, Paris, Frankfurt and Schiphol will not wait, and British aviation will, regrettably, pay the price. Is that right? The Government hesitate. Behind all the Minister’s soft words, there is still hesitation, and there is no certainty that further delay will result in decisive action, which is what is required at the moment. Is there no possibility of speeding things up? Many people are divided on this issue. As a former Aviation Minister, I consider that we must act speedily, and the delay which the Minister recommends is not the right decision.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

First, I assure the noble Lord that they are not soft words. I fully acknowledge that it may be a soft tone, which reflects the nature of your Lordships’ Chamber, but the message is very clear. The Government have today made a decision regarding the three viable options presented to us by a thoroughly researched report by the Davies commission. We have taken the decision today to proceed on one of those options: the new runway at Heathrow. Linked to that, we are following the designated process as laid out in the Planning Act 2008. I am sometimes asked how other countries have done this or that faster. We have a specific planning process that we need to follow; otherwise we are into the realms of other challenges—and I do not for a moment doubt that there will be other challenges. We need to ensure that our processes are robust, stand up to scrutiny and reflect our legislative processes. In this case, the 2008 Act is very clear and the national policy statement will now follow.

Airports: London

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Clinton-Davis

Tuesday 11th October 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

The noble Lord raises an important issue about regional connectivity and regional airports. I had the opportunity to visit Birmingham last week and I saw its plans. The noble Lord is quite right that, once HS2 has been built, it will take 30-odd minutes to go from London Euston to Birmingham. That underlines the importance of ensuring that our national infrastructure supports the general infrastructure of aviation. The regional connectivity of airports will be in my review of the airport policy framework.

[Lord Clinton-Davis (Lab)]

How long have the Government and others had to make up their minds about London’s additional runways? Does the Minister believe that it is possible for some sort of decision to be advanced rather than, as I fear it will be, regarded as something that can be withdrawn?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

The noble Lord raises the important issue that a decision needs to be made. I assure your Lordships’ House that the Government are looking to make that decision. They also fully appreciate and understand the importance of making a decision in this respect to ensuring the continuing viability and growth of the British economy.

Airports: London

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Clinton-Davis

Monday 5th September 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

That is a very open-ended question but I would be very much inclined to say to my noble friend: sooner.

[Lord Clinton-Davis (Lab)]

My Lords, I congratulate the noble Lord, Lord Spicer, on his unremitting campaign for the best interests of British aviation. Is it not clear that the longer a decision on this vital issue is delayed, the worse it will be for British aviation? In my view, a decision should have been made long ago, and the Government are playing for time. The more we encounter delay, the more British aviation will suffer while its rivals manage to march forward unremittingly.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I agree with the noble Lord about the way in which my noble friend Lord Spicer has ensured that this issue is kept at the forefront. I assure all noble Lords that the importance of the aviation sector is a high priority for this Government. I further assure the noble Lord that the decision that will be taken will be in the best interests of the aviation sector, as well as of the country as a whole.

Airport Capacity in London

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Clinton-Davis

Wednesday 16th December 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I would say first to my noble friend that 50 years ago, I certainly was not under the flight path, but I am one of those who, through issues of birth, are under the flight path now. Nevertheless, my noble friend raises the important issue of the UK economy. Let me assure him that the Government are committed to ensuring that the right decision is taken on south-east airport expansion and that a major determinant of that is to ensure the continued competitiveness of the UK.

[Lord Clinton-Davis (Lab)]

The Minister is fast earning a reputation for escaping entirely from responsibility. Purely for political purposes, the Government have dithered and dithered. Other airports in Europe, as has already been said, thrive while British aviation disappears. Is it not more important than anything that while the Government adopt their present stance, the country suffers?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

It is for others to judge the noble Lord’s first comment, but the Government take their responsibility very seriously, and that is why they are taking their time to ensure that the right decision, a considered decision, is taken on which of the three viable options should be moved forward. The Davies commission reported that new expansion needs to happen by 2030 and I assure the noble Lord and all other noble Lords that whatever decision is taken will ensure that that timetable will be met.

Airport Capacity

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Clinton-Davis

Monday 14th December 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I thank my noble friend for his questions. He has been a consistent and vociferous questioner on this issue; indeed, he has another Question on the subject on Wednesday. He mentioned a particular scoreline. To get political for a moment, I certainly hope that there is a 1-0 scoreline when it comes to the May election in favour of my honourable friend in the other place.

My noble friend talked about the impact on the economy. I agree with him, and the Government feel very strongly that there is a need to make a decision that is based on the right decisions for the economy, the country and, as I have said specifically in my Statement, the environment.

We are now well connected. As my noble friend points out, there are constraints and they are beginning to bite. By 2040, all major south-eastern airports will be full. Failing to address this would cost passengers between £21 billion and £23 billion, and of course there would be wider indications for the economy, estimated to be in the region of £30 billion to £45 billion. However, with regard to the timetable of summer 2016 that I have talked about, the Davies commission reported that, whatever decision or option was chosen, we would need to complete by 2030. I assure the noble Lord that this would still allow for that decision to be taken and the appropriate expansion to take place in good time to meet the 2030 deadline.

[Lord Clinton-Davis (Lab)]

My Lords, this is an absolute abdication of responsibility. British aviation has been put in a secondary position compared with other vital industries. What has been advanced is the interests of the Conservative Party, and as a result our competitors are going to be richly rewarded. Putting aside the Minister’s discomfort, should we not consider how best British aviation can recover from this grievous blow? Meanwhile, words hurriedly uttered by the Minister are no alternative to government policy.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I assure the noble Lord that we are moving forward. I have talked of the timetable that we are moving to. As I said earlier, it will ensure that we meet the required deadline. Whatever decision is taken, the Government have accepted in principle the findings of the Davies commission. Three options were put forward and none was discarded by the commission. We are ensuring that all three stay on the table, and we are firmly committed to south-eastern airport expansion. The important thing is to ensure that all considerations are taken into account. With the timetable that we have outlined, we will be able to proceed forward. It will be a great asset for UK plc to ensure that we reach a decision quickly on south-eastern airport expansion capacity in summer next year.

Airports: London

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Clinton-Davis

Tuesday 13th October 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

It is for the very reason that my noble friend has articulated—the importance of making a considered decision which is not subject to judicial review—that the Government are fully considering all the evidence in the commission’s report and will report on their final decision in due course.

[Lord Clinton-Davis (Lab)]

Does the Minister appreciate that while we prevaricate over the choice of the extra runways, Paris, Schiphol and Frankfurt are going ahead inevitably and inexorably? Are we not paying a very heavy price for the delay that is happening at the moment? I am delighted that, as former Ministers with responsibility for aviation, the noble Lord, Lord Spicer, and I both have no doubt about what should happen.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

The noble Lord raises an important point about retaining the competitiveness of London alongside those who are competing for business across Europe. He referred to his experience and that of my noble friend. It is for that very reason that I am sure he would agree that the Government need to ensure that they make a considered response that is not open to judicial review.

Syria: Christian Refugees

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Clinton-Davis

Wednesday 9th September 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Clinton-Davis]

My Lords, people of many faiths and none have sought refuge from oppression not only in Syria but elsewhere. Accordingly, are they not entitled to expect to be regarded in a much more benign and civilised way than this Government have exhibited so far?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

As I said yesterday from this Dispatch Box, and as my noble friend the Leader of the House said, this country has a history of showing mercy and tolerance. Also underlying our policy is showing humanity towards any persecuted minority or people across the world. We continue to do so, and that applies no differently when dealing with the Syrian refugee crisis.

Airports Commission

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Clinton-Davis

Monday 7th September 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I would never accuse my noble friend of dodging anything. If he did so that was his assessment; I thought he handled questions in this respect very ably from the Dispatch Box. I reiterate that the Government—and indeed the Prime Minister—have made it clear that a decision will be made and it will be made by the end of the year.

[Lord Clinton-Davis (Lab)]

Whatever option is pursued, is it not clear that the cost will be enormous? Is not the real issue this: how best and how quickly we can advance British aviation in the best possible way? Surely it is apparent that there is only one answer and it is becoming blindingly obvious—Heathrow.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

Again, I feel I am repeating myself. The Government have made their position very clear. The report has been received, it is being considered and a decision will be made. Of course the Government recognise the importance of Heathrow as well as other airports around the country. We continue to regard the importance of aviation in developing, furthering and strengthening the British economy.

Davies Commission Report

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Clinton-Davis

Wednesday 1st July 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I am sure that the noble Baroness heard the Prime Minister responding to PMQs, when he said that the important thing was to move forward on the decision. She referred to the comments of the Prime Minister, “no ifs, no buts”, but what he was commenting on at that time was a very different proposition for Heathrow. Following this, we made the decision to set up the Airports Commission. It was the Prime Minister’s decision and that of the last Government—indeed, the noble Baroness’s party were part of that Government. That is what we have now done, and the option put forward for Heathrow now is a very different one from the one proposed in 2010.

[Lord Clinton-Davis (Lab)]

My Lords—

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, I assure the noble Lord that the issue of security through aviation—indeed through all modes—is something that the Government take very seriously. Perhaps I speak with a special interest, because I am the Minister for Aviation Security at the Department for Transport.

[Lord Clinton-Davis]

There can be no doubt that the Davies report has come down in favour of Heathrow, but there are certain details that have to be addressed. Can the Minister say that, in the autumn, the Government will make a firm decision? That is imperative, in my view. The report also stressed that an early decision is absolutely imperative. The delay would be immensely dangerous, particularly since the Government commissioned the report in the first place. It would imperil British aviation, and it would imperil our economic advantages and our situation in the global economy, as well as our standing as a nation. Does the Minister not agree that an early decision is absolutely vital?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I do agree, and the challenge now is to make decisions that are reflective of what has been a very well-balanced report and are also, as I have said, in the best interests of the country. I assure the noble Lord that the Government will carefully consider the commission’s extensive report without delay. By the autumn, I want to get to a stage where we can set out a position to Parliament on the way we want to take forward this work.

Airports: London

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Clinton-Davis

Tuesday 2nd June 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

It was the previous Government who set up the Airports Commission to explore all options and it is right that we wait until it has produced its report. I say to my noble friend that perhaps he will not have to wait much longer.

[Lord Clinton-Davis (Lab)]

If British aviation is to thrive, does the Minister not agree that an early decision about the siting of our airports is absolutely essential? He has not said anything about when the Government will make up their mind. It is all very well to wait for a report, but does he not have some indication already about the suitability of Gatwick or Heathrow? I personally support Heathrow but it is vital that we do something about that, and do it quickly.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

The Government recognise the challenge of capacity and the need to make a decision, but it is also right that if you set up a commission, you wait for its result—its independent decision—and act accordingly. As I said in my opening remarks, and as my right honourable friend the Chancellor has said, as soon as the report has been received the Government will seek to make their decision on the recommendations that they receive.

Legal Aid

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Clinton-Davis

Wednesday 8th January 2014 Lords Chamber

[Lord Clinton-Davis]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what is their response to the protests by lawyers on 6 January concerning further cuts to legal aid.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, we have engaged constructively with lawyers over a period of many months and we continue to do so. However, the fact remains that we have one of the most expensive legal aid systems in the world and in the current economic climate this is not sustainable for taxpayers, who fund it. We have to find efficiencies to ensure that legal aid is sustained and available for those most in need of a lawyer.

[Lord Clinton-Davis (Lab)]

I thank the Minister for that uninformative Answer. Does he recognise that the Justice Alliance, representing a large number of people and organisations and many senior judges, has expressed its concern about these proposals? Is it not the case that these cuts will lead to more, not less, expenditure, that cases will be bound to last much longer when people are unrepresented, that there will be a reduction in standards and that there will be more miscarriages of justice and an inevitable increase in guilty pleas? Is not the Minister concerned about all those things, as expressed by reputable organisations?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, the Government have undertaken to listen, consult and work with the profession, and we continue to do so. However, in the current economic climate and indeed with the crisis that we inherited, we needed to look across the board to ensure that efficiencies could be had. Even with the efficiencies that we will be making from this series of cuts, £1.5 billion will continue to be spent on legal aid—a figure that is among the highest in the world.