Separation Centres Review

Debate between Lord Addington and Lord Keen of Elie

Tuesday 10th February 2026 Lords Chamber

[Lord Keen of Elie (Con)]

My Lords, I welcome the opportunity to respond to the Government’s Statement on separation centres and the independent review by Jonathan Hall KC. While the review itself contains important material, we must be frank about several critical issues that have been raised both in and out of Parliament.

First, on the fundamental question of what threat we are talking about when discussing the need for separation centres, the reality is clear. Islamist extremism remains the predominant form of extremist offending within our prison estate. As the shadow Justice Secretary pointed out in the other place, Security Service statistics show that Islamist-related threats form the majority of the counterterrorism focus, and most terrorist prisoners in custody are convicted on Islamist-related charges. This is not a matter of debate but an acknowledgement of the practical threat that separation centres are designed to contain, and it must inform both policy and parliamentary scrutiny.

Secondly, we have concerns about the Government’s stated intention to look at litigation based on Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights. While that may offer superficial reassurance, it is in fact Article 3 of the convention that is the real legal barrier. Article 3 is absolute. There are no exceptions, no public order or national security carve-outs and no limited derogations. It prohibits inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment in the strongest terms, as that may be interpreted.

We have already seen its damaging consequences in our own courts. In the case of Abu v Secretary of State for Justice, the High Court found that prolonged segregation of a convicted terrorist, who was already in a separation centre, amounted to inhuman or degrading treatment, in breach of Article 3. It was found that Ministers had failed to account for his mental health needs adequately before imposing those conditions. This was a binding judicial judgment, applying the European convention directly to the operation of separation regimes in England and Wales.

Let us be clear: Article 3 cannot be overridden or restricted by statute or ministerial policy; it is absolute. No amount of legislative tweaking proposed by the Justice Secretary will permit separation conditions that our courts find contravene Article 3. If the Government’s strong desire is to insulate separation centre management from litigation, they will find that Article 3 presents the true legal limit, far beyond anything provided by Article 8, which is a qualified act. I therefore ask the Minister to confirm precisely what steps the Government intend to take in relation to Article 3. How, in practical and legal terms, do they plan to deal with the fact that the law, as it stands, prohibits what is interpreted to be inhuman or degrading treatment, even in the face of compelling public safety arguments?

In these circumstances, while we want to ensure that our prisons are safe, that our staff are protected and that dangerous offenders cannot radicalise others or cause greater mayhem, clearly there is a fundamental problem with the legal constraints imposed by the convention, and the Government need to address these.

[Lord Addington (LD)]

My Lords, when it comes to the basic question that has already been raised today—the European Convention on Human Rights—I am afraid that my Benches very much disagree with the noble and learned Lord who has just spoken. It was Churchill who said that it is the way you treat your prisoners that defines you as civilised. So are we going to make sure that we define their rights? If we look at this in practical terms, how are we going to balance this out?

If we are going to make sure that the prison officers in charge of this are safe—that is surely one of the most important parts here—when will the Minister be able to tell us whether we have gone through the improved training programmes that have been suggested and when they will have the equipment they need? These are two fundamental things.

The secure centres mean that we are not going to allow this highly dangerous section of prisoners into the main prison population, which is right; radicalisation has always been a problem in prisons, and we are doing something to stop it here. It is not only Islamic terrorists but far-right extremists—I think it was 60%, 30% and then 10% of other groups, if I understood the figures right. What are we doing to make sure these people are isolated and do not make the situation worse, and are we going to make sure that those who are containing it are properly equipped? That is the basic question here.

I appreciate that the Government have moved and have accepted Jonathan Hall’s recommendations. The timeframe is very important, as then we will know what we are going to expect from the Government and will be able to judge how it has succeeded. I hope that the Minister will be able to answer these basic questions in fairly short order.

Euro 2016: Fan Violence

Debate between Lord Addington and Lord Keen of Elie

Tuesday 14th June 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Keen of Elie]

I entirely concur with the observations of the noble Lord with regard to the outrageous behaviour of a very small minority of English supporters, which casts a shadow upon all those others who simply wish to enjoy a UEFA championship tournament. With regard to further steps and to policing within stadiums, one has to bear in mind that the conditions for policing and the segregation of fans differ between Europe and our domestic football league. Under the present UEFA rules, it is not possible for the police to be stationed within the stadium during the match. Consequently, segregation is left to stewards within the stadium. That is the subject of ongoing discussion.

With regard to further assistance from this Government, further police officers were requested by the French, and police spotters will be provided in Lens in the run-up to the match between England and Wales. In addition, British Transport Police officers have been stationed on cross-channel services, and indeed on services to Lens and up to Lille itself. Furthermore, the Foreign Office has given advice that those without tickets should not travel to Lens or to Lille. As the noble Lord observed, on the day before the match in Lens there is a match between Russia and Slovakia in Lille.

[Lord Addington (LD)]

My Lords, first, we express our condolences to all those innocent parties caught up in this violence. Secondly, can the Minister give us some assurance that co-operation between European states, whether in or out of the EU, is very important, and that such things as are available to us, including the European arrest warrant, will be used to pursue anybody who we discover has been involved in this after the event, if not before?

[Lord Keen of Elie]

I cannot say to what extent the European arrest warrant will have to be deployed in respect of persons responsible for these actions in France. However, persons who return to England may be subject to the civil procedure relating to football banning orders, which results in the loss of their passports. With regard to co-operation, there has been co-operation between the English and French police authorities since well before the championship began, and that co-operation continues.