Informal European Council

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown Excerpts

Tuesday 31st January 2012 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

My hon. Friend is right to raise this matter. Clearly the Russians have taken a different view up to now and have not supported robust action at the Security Council. My right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary is trying to build the strongest possible resolution with colleagues at the Security Council and to say to the Russians, “If you go on vetoing or preventing these motions, you will be completely outside not just world public opinion, but the very clearly expressed opinion of the Arab League itself.”

[Geoffrey Clifton-Brown (The Cotswolds) (Con)]

Is not my right hon. Friend’s strategy of rejecting the fiscal union treaty, which would not be in Britain’s economic interests, and at the same time pushing for a free trade agreement with Canada, Japan and India, which has the potential to create thousands of jobs in this country, absolutely the right one?

[The Prime Minister]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend. I think that Britain is better off outside the eurozone, but clearly we need to get trade going with parts of the world that are growing faster, which is why these trade deals are so important to us.

EU Council

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown Excerpts

Monday 12th December 2011 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

First, I went to Feltham and Heston because I do not believe in the normal chicken theory that Prime Ministers should stay away from by-elections, so I am proud to have gone. I spoke to a wide audience of DHL employees who live in the constituency and encouraged them to vote Conservative before Christmas. After that, I popped in to see my son’s nativity play, which was also a rare joy. I got to the European Council some time before it started and met the Italian Prime Minister, the French President and the German Prime Minister. In addition, I had had a series of telephone calls with the Dutch Prime Minister, the Swedish Prime Minister and many others besides. I am sure that the hon. Lady understands—it is called multi-tasking.

[Geoffrey Clifton-Brown (The Cotswolds) (Con)]

My right hon. Friend had no option but to use his veto, if British interests were to be protected. Does he agree that the euro sovereign debt crisis is still the most important threat to us all and that that is what our eurozone partners ought to be concentrating on, rather than unwanted treaty changes?

[The Prime Minister]

My hon. Friend makes a very good point. I quite understand why particularly the Germans want this fiscal union and want tougher rules because they do not want to see irresponsible behaviour repeat itself. One can debate whether that actually requires change in the treaty or not, but we have to spend more time on the other parts of solving the crisis, which are to do with short-term changes and longer-term competitiveness.

Libya

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown Excerpts

Monday 5th September 2011 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

The answer to the right hon. Gentleman is that it is a series of permanent conversations, particularly those that my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary is having. At the European level, there is a high degree of unity—in some ways, I think the EU has led the way, particularly with the oil embargo—but we also need to have, and are having, strong discussions with the permanent members of the Security Council. The right hon. Gentleman’s hon. Friend the Member for Rhondda (Chris Bryant) mentioned Russia, which I shall be visiting soon. We also need discussions with the non-permanent members like South Africa and others, and more widely, including with the Arab League, so that we build international support. There is no substitute for a lot of hard work and diplomacy to try to build the strongest possible coalition.

[Geoffrey Clifton-Brown (The Cotswolds) (Con)]

My right hon. Friend’s actions, saving many lives in Libya, have been totally vindicated. So that the national transitional council is not overwhelmed with offers of help, who will take the lead in reconstruction in Libya and precisely what role will this country play?

[The Prime Minister]

I am very grateful to my hon. Friend for what he said. The key is building up—and my right hon. Friend the International Development Secretary has been key to this—a Libyan-led and Libyan-owned plan for transition. It is Libya’s plan—we have assisted and helped to co-ordinate, but it is the Libyans’ plan; others can then slot into it. It has been interesting to hear what they want—not always the things that one might expect. The biggest single demand made in Paris was for temporary classrooms, because so many schools had been used by Gaddafi’s forces, and for some temporary housing. We will fit into these requests, but it is a Libyan-led plan.

House of Lords Reform (Draft Bill)

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown Excerpts

Tuesday 17th May 2011 Commons Chamber

[The Deputy Prime Minister]

As I said earlier, every time that has been looked at on a cross-party basis, the conclusion has been reached that in order to entrench rather than undermine the difference between the other place and this House, it is best to do so by giving any elected Members of a reformed House of Lords a long, non-renewable term so that they are not subject to the normal short-term temptations of party politics, to which some of us might be subject in this place.

[Geoffrey Clifton-Brown (The Cotswolds) (Con)]

May I remind the Deputy Prime Minister and the House that the Japanese recently reformed their upper House from an appointed House to an elected House? That led to a huge loss of talent, a situation where the upper House has a complete veto over most legislation of the lower elected House, and legislative stalemate. Would we not be very foolish to embark on these reforms?

[The Deputy Prime Minister]

First, I do not accept the principal assertion that if someone has the audacity to stand for election, somehow they do not have talent. That conclusion would not be favourable to anyone in the House. The assumption that wisdom and expertise can be possessed only by those who have not subjected themselves to election is an assumption that I have always found curious. Secondly, the hon. Gentleman refers to what happened in Japan, but he should look at bicameral systems across the democratic world that manage a relationship between one Chamber and the other perfectly well, even though there is election to both.

Counter-terrorism

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown Excerpts

Tuesday 3rd May 2011 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I think there are bilateral actions that Britain, as an old and successful democracy, should take and links that we should make, such as updating the Westminster Foundation for Democracy, as we have discussed in this House before. However, the biggest step would be for the European Union radically to overhaul its programme of help and assistance to north African and middle eastern neighbours and countries. Frankly, its programme up to now has been quite expensive—there is no shortage of money being spent—but it has not been successful in putting in place those building blocks of democracy. That is what we should be working on.

[Geoffrey Clifton-Brown (The Cotswolds) (Con)]

Does my right hon. Friend agree that it is imperative to provide every possible military, diplomatic and development assistance to Pakistan, not only to build democracy in the longer term, but to help to improve security in the shorter term, which is inextricably linked with a successful exit strategy from Afghanistan?

[The Prime Minister]

I agree that we need to build those links. Clearly there has to be a two-way relationship: we must not be too transactional about it, but we need to be clear with the Pakistanis about what we hope to gain from the partnership that we enter into. Clearly, work on counter-terrorism is vital to Britain’s national interest, but we are prepared to do a huge amount with Pakistan to help with matters such as the education of children. There are 17 million children in Pakistan not at school today. If we want to keep them away from extremism and, indeed, if we want to deal with problems of migration as well, it makes sense for us to continue our aid programme.

Libya/European Council

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown Excerpts

Monday 28th March 2011 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I am grateful for what my hon. Friend says. It is right to have debates in the House and to do so on the basis of a proper Cabinet decision. Let me just say that we have published not the legal advice, but a note based on the legal advice, and we will stick to the convention that the Government are entitled to receive legal advice confidentially, and then to act in the terms of that legal advice. When we are being asked all sorts of questions about what is legal and illegal under a UN Security Council resolution, I think that that is the right approach.

[Geoffrey Clifton-Brown (The Cotswolds) (Con)]

Does my right hon. Friend agree that the biggest economic boost to Europe would be a successful conclusion of the Doha trade round? Was he not entirely right to keep the Council focused on that matter, and will he update us on progress?

[The Prime Minister]

The issue is about trade both internally within Europe and externally between Europe and other countries. On the first one, it is about completing the single market, and the point to remember is that the single market does not apply to four-fifths of our economy if it does not apply to services properly. On Doha, it is still extremely hard going, but if the Chinese and the Americans can agree to enlarge what is on offer, there is still a prospect of making progress this year. We really need those two countries, however, to focus on the fact that there is a benefit to both of them if they show the political bravery to re-open things and try to make the deal larger.

United Nations Security Council Resolution 1973

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown Excerpts

Monday 21st March 2011 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I will give way to my parliamentary neighbour.

[Geoffrey Clifton-Brown (The Cotswolds) (Con)]

May I congratulate the Prime Minister on obtaining the UN resolution to give us the legal cover that we require? The problem with Iraq was that there was no proper post-war reconstruction plan. Is he giving thought to what a post-war reconstruction plan ought to be, and will he encourage members of the Arab League to play their full part in that once the military phase is over?

[The Prime Minister]

My hon. Friend makes an extremely important point about humanitarian planning for afterwards, which I will come to later in my speech. My right hon. Friend the International Development Secretary is leading cross-Government work to ensure that that plan is robust. However, let me be frank about one difficulty that we have. Because we are saying that there will not be an invasion and that there will not be an occupation, we must have a different sort of plan—a much more international plan with a greater role for the UN, the EU and aid agencies, all of which we will support.

--- Later in debate ---

[Geoffrey Clifton-Brown (The Cotswolds) (Con)]

The more serious the situation, the better this House responds. That has been proved by some very fine speeches today. I wholeheartedly congratulate the Prime Minister, the Foreign Secretary and their respective teams on their incredibly hard work over the past seven days. Many people were sceptical about the possibility of the UN agreeing to a no-fly zone. That agreement is therefore a great tribute to the diplomatic effort. The reasons for military intervention are clear and have been well rehearsed by Members from all parts of the House. I fully support the motion. I pay tribute to our armed forces for what they have achieved in such a short time.

I will turn to the future of Libya. On the BBC World Service earlier today, Rear-Admiral Chris Parry said:

“We really do have to get to grips with what happens afterwards. If we don’t, the military campaign will lose momentum, it will lack coherence and we’ll lose broader political support within the Islamic world.”

The pre-emptive action to establish a no-fly zone is almost complete. Colonel Gaddafi’s forces may well be starved of the necessary support and halted short of rebel strongholds. However, an impasse could follow. We must have a clear and coherent plan for how Libya can get to the next stage; for how the Libyan people, if it is their wish, can overthrow the Gaddafi regime; and for what might follow in its wake.

Before the invasion of Iraq, I criticised the then Government in this House for the lack of a post-conflict reconstruction plan. That was one of the most important reasons for the insurgency and violence following the fall of Saddam Hussein’s regime, and for the reconstruction of that country taking so long. It is vital that steps are taken now to ensure that that situation is not repeated in Libya.

Gaddafi still has significant capacity to defend himself and the so-called rebel force currently lacks the ability to overthrow him. It is unclear from UN resolution 1973 what more can be done in such a stalemate, as Members in all parts of the House have said. The resolution specifically excludes

“a foreign occupation force of any form on any part of Libyan territory”.

An amendment to that resolution or a new resolution that allowed occupying troops to be sent in would be unacceptable to this House and to this country. There is no appetite among the British public to be drawn into another potentially lengthy conflict. We have been in Afghanistan for almost 10 years and our armed forces, particularly the Army, need a break from conflict. Likewise, I do not think that arming the rebels would be wise. The west armed the mujaheddin in Afghanistan and Saddam Hussein during the Iran-Iraq war, and the consequences of those decisions are being felt to this day. When we arm one side, it is never quite clear where those arms will end up.

It is up to the people of Libya to push through a change of governance, but how they will do so remains unclear. I hope that the talk of a partition in Libya will be quashed at the earliest opportunity. To leave Gaddafi in the west and a new Government in the east would create far greater instability in the future, and would undoubtedly lead to further conflict.

Undoubtedly, the most important factor in planning for the future of Libya is support from its fellow Arab nations. The Arab League’s endorsement of the no-fly zone was clearly pivotal in securing it. We now need more countries to participate in it. I hope that this is the beginning of a process in which the UK, US, France and others work closely with the Arab League and Arab countries to consider the future of Libya. In the near future, Libya will need more assistance from its regional friends and neighbours. They can play a positive and constructive role in rebuilding the infrastructure of Libya and in helping to form a new nation. Ultimately, all members of the coalition need to speak with one voice to show their decisiveness and resolve to see this matter through. That extends in particular to the European Union and its officials.

I hope that this moment will represent a sea change in the Arab world, as the Prime Minister rightly said, and particularly among those leaders who oppress their peoples. After Iraq and Afghanistan, it was perhaps thought that the west would no longer intervene in the middle east under any circumstances. This action has shown dictators and tyrants everywhere in the world that they need to think twice before brutalising their own people and committing war crimes.

I end with a quotation that has been used by the right hon. Member for Lagan Valley (Mr Donaldson), but which is apposite. As a former Member of this House, Edmund Burke, said to his electors in Bristol, all that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. It would be very wrong for us to do nothing in this case.

Japan and the Middle East

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown Excerpts

Monday 14th March 2011 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

The hon. Lady makes a point. There are many lessons to learn from all stages of the conflict in the former Yugoslavia, perhaps Bosnia in particular. One can make all sorts of arguments about whether the arms embargo should have been lifted, or whether there should have been tougher action earlier against the Serbs, but the most important lesson was that the international community has to be engaged and decisive at an earlier stage. That is the lesson that we should learn.

[Geoffrey Clifton-Brown (The Cotswolds) (Con)]

In welcoming my right hon. Friend’s stance in leading the international community in taking difficult decisions against Gaddafi, will he remind it that Gaddafi has form? He launched a brutal military takeover in 1968 and became the leader of a pariah state that tried to acquire nuclear weapons in the 1970s and 1980s. Is it not imperative that the international community takes action now?

[The Prime Minister]

This is an important point for people who are traditionally sceptical about these sorts of measures. We should consider what life could be like with a Gaddafi in charge of a pariah Libyan state, with all the oil money it would have and all the ability it would have to wreak havoc internationally. We know what this man is capable of, because we have seen it in the past with Lockerbie and all the other problems, not least his funding of the IRA.

Oral Answers to Questions

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown Excerpts

Wednesday 24th November 2010 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

What we do at our borders is incredibly important. I spent some time yesterday with the Home Secretary at Heathrow airport, meeting UK Border Agency staff. They do a fantastic job, and I want to help them go on doing it. I shall look carefully at what the hon. Gentleman says—[Interruption.] The answer is that what we are going to do is make sure that immigration work is done in Northern Ireland rather than at Stranraer, but I shall look very carefully at that to make sure that the system is working.

[Geoffrey Clifton-Brown (The Cotswolds) (Con)]

Does my right hon. Friend agree that a proper and well planned international rescue plan for the Irish economy would be far less damaging to the wider economy of this country than some of the possible dire alternatives?

[The Prime Minister]

My hon. Friend makes a very good point. Every man, woman and child in Ireland spends more than £3,000 each year on British goods and services. Our economies are very intertwined—very interlinked—and it is right that we take part in helping to ensure stability and growth in the Irish economy.