Deregulation: Public Services and Health and Safety

Debate between Baroness Young of Old Scone and Lord Prior of Brampton

Thursday 13th July 2017 Lords Chamber

[Lord Prior of Brampton]

I have forgotten where I had got to. The noble Baroness, Lady Andrews, raised a rather existential question at the beginning of her speech when she asked, “What kind of state do we want to live in?”. Many noble Lords on the other side may be thinking about that at the moment, as noble Lords on our side may also be. I heard the Mayor of London on “Newsnight” last night talking about London and the tale of two cities: the invisible people as well as the visible people. This awful tragedy at Grenfell goes far beyond the narrow issues we have been talking about today. It asks all of us what kind of state we want to live in. However, I take issue with one point the noble Baroness made, when she said that we were ideologically opposed to regulation. As someone who was chairman of the Care Quality Commission for several years and has been quite heavily involved in education for many years, I can tell the noble Baroness that we are not ideologically opposed to regulation; I will address that issue later on in my speech.

I will go further than that and say that regulation is essential to any civilised society. The noble Lord, Lord Whitty, referred back to Lord Shaftesbury. I had hoped that Lord Shaftesbury was a Tory, but I note that as it happens, he was a Whig. However, many former Conservative Prime Ministers throughout the Victorian age were at the forefront of bringing regulation into the factories, to chimneys and the like. So let us be absolutely clear that regulation has a long and proud history and that it is an important and crucial part of improving people’s lives. That does not mean, as a number of noble Lords said, that all regulation is perfect, or that some regulations have gone beyond their sell-by date. All regulation needs to be kept under constant review.

We have heard a number of examples from the environmental field, particularly from the noble Lord, Lord Smith, and there has been no question that regulation has achieved hugely beneficial things. The noble Baroness, Lady Young, mentioned beaches and water quality, as well as air quality and the like. There is no question that regulations have had a huge impact to the good in that area. However, the noble Baroness is concerned within the context of Brexit about some of the principles that underlie some of that EU regulation. For example, she mentioned the principle that the polluter pays. There is nothing to stop us incorporating that as a principle in our future environmental legislation here, and in a post-Brexit world we can carry on many of the good things that have come out of Europe, of which there are many. The noble Baroness mentioned pollution in the inner Thames. The Thames tideway project will remove 60 million litres of raw sewage out of the Thames, and we can do that both in or outside Europe.

[Baroness Young of Old Scone]

It is slightly fishy that action on the tideway happened only when Europe threatened to fine us.

[Lord Prior of Brampton]

Europe has brought us many good things.

Health: Diabetes and Obesity

Debate between Baroness Young of Old Scone and Lord Prior of Brampton

Thursday 30th June 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Prior of Brampton]

Of course they should be giving that advice, and indeed they are. There is also clear advice on the Public Health England website as to what is the right diet. Confusing messages have been given over the past couple of months. Therefore, I think it would do no harm to repeat in the obesity strategy what is the right diet.

[Baroness Young of Old Scone (Lab)]

My Lords, is the Minister aware of recent emerging research that confirms the view that has been held for some time that if people with type 2 diabetes—and there are 3.5 million of them in this country—reduce their weight by 10% and take modest regular exercise, in a significant number of cases the effects and complications of their diabetes can be put into long-term remission with consequent reductions of pressure on NHS resources and capacity? Despite that, less than 10% of people with diabetes get any such help in reducing their weight and increasing their exercise, and therefore having the option and opportunity of turning off their diabetes. This issue has been raised significantly over the past five years. What urgent steps can the Minister outline, rather than simply relying on local action that is clearly not working?

[Lord Prior of Brampton]

The noble Baroness is clearly right that weight reduction can reverse diabetes. My father, for example, has lost weight and his diabetes has, effectively, been put into remission. There is no question that it works. However, it is very difficult to lose weight once you are overweight. The figure is that only one in 210 people with a BMI of over 30 can reduce it to a normal level; hence the emphasis that the Government are putting on explaining this to children and young people before they get fat. That is the critical place to aim. However, I entirely agree that greater access to structured education programmes is very important.

NHS: Diabetes

Debate between Baroness Young of Old Scone and Lord Prior of Brampton

Thursday 26th May 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Prior of Brampton]

My Lords, I am not sure that that question has much to do with the original Question on the Order Paper. However, without the levels of immigration that we have had in the past, the NHS simply could not operate.

[Baroness Young of Old Scone (Lab)]

Is the Minister aware that one of the most cost-effective interventions in the care of people with diabetes is to educate them in how to manage their own condition in order to avoid progressing to the costly complications which constitute 90% of the costs to the NHS? Is he also aware that we are still bumping along with less than 10% of people with diabetes receiving any education whatever in how to self-manage their condition daily? What plans do the Government have to increase that figure stratospherically, to a point where all people with diabetes are not only offered education but are encouraged to take it up and use it?

[Lord Prior of Brampton]

The noble Baroness will know a lot about the diabetes prevention strategy that is being launched with the support of PHE and Diabetes UK, and about the DESMOND and DAFNE structured education programmes. The plan is to roll out the prevention strategy across the whole country by 2020, at which time we expect that at least 100,000 people will have personalised support, which will include structured education.