Media: Ownership
Debate between Baroness O'Neill of Bengarve and Baroness Rawlings
Baroness Rawlings
My Lords, my noble friend Lord Ryder asks a fascinating and important question. In determining the appropriate size of media ownership, we will be considering the extent to which websites should be included. The current rules are outdated and do not even acknowledge the existence of websites, yet websites could conceivably have an important role in controlling access to new sources and have implications for plurality. That is why the Secretary of State has asked Ofcom to look into this matter, and we will consider carefully the recommendations that Lord Justice Leveson makes in this area.
Baroness O'Neill of Bengarve
My Lords, will the noble Baroness tell the House whether, in considering issues of plurality, the Government will also consider issues of diversity, as these are not the same? Plurality does not always guarantee diversity, which is what citizens need.
Baroness Rawlings
My Lords, plurality in the context of media ownership refers to the number of owners and size of ownership of different media outlets and does not cover diversity, as the noble Baroness mentioned. I am sure all noble Lords agree that a healthy democracy needs correct information, and, in general, to be able to participate effectively in a political process, access is needed to all sides of the debate. However, this is unlikely to happen if the media are under the control of a too tightly restricted number of owners.
Media: News International
Debate between Baroness O'Neill of Bengarve and Baroness Rawlings
Baroness Rawlings
My Lords, my noble friend Lord Roberts goes right to the heart of the matter and he is right to look into the future. His most important point is on the need to regain the confidence of the public. Clearly, the current regime of the Press Complaints Commission has not been effective. That is why the draft terms of reference for Lord Justice Leveson’s inquiry require recommendation for a new, more effective policy and regulatory regime which supports the integrity and freedom of the press, the plurality of the media and their independence from government, while encouraging the highest ethical and professional standards. The PCC is a self-regulatory, self-appointed, independent body and it is not for the Government to say what will or will not happen to it. That will be a matter for the press and media.
Baroness O'Neill of Bengarve
My Lords, does the Minister agree that the purpose of having a free press is for the sake of citizens, not for self-expression by the media? If it is to be for the sake of citizens, the press has to communicate. If it is to communicate, there must be standards and these have to be genuinely independently overseen, not independent in the sense in which the Press Complaints Commission is independent.
Baroness Rawlings
My Lords, the noble Baroness makes a very valid point, to which the Prime Minister will be speaking this morning.
Phone Hacking
Debate between Baroness O'Neill of Bengarve and Baroness Rawlings
Baroness Rawlings
My Lords, my noble friend Lord Crickhowell backs up the most important point: that the Secretary of State will need time for the whole process without rushing the police inquiry—my noble friend is quite right to say that several inquiries are already ongoing—and that he is free to delay it. Ofcom and the Office of Fair Trading will also have to report. The Competition Commission must report too, though within six to 18 months at the outside limit. As for the judge-led inquiry to decide, one hopes that it will not take too long. If noble Lords think back to the Saville inquiry, which took 12 years and £200 million, one hopes that this inquiry will come through a little faster.
Baroness O'Neill of Bengarve
My Lords, will the Minister clarify one point that has become less clear during the past half hour? She has spoken of inquiries having been established. Has the remit of the judge-led inquiry been made public? Until it is, I believe that the point made by the noble and learned Baroness, Lady Scotland, stands—namely, that it is unclear what constitutes evidence and it will not be a criminal offence to destroy evidence. I should be very grateful if the Minister could tell us whether the remit is in the public domain; and, if not, when it will be.
Baroness Rawlings
My Lords, the first inquiry will be an independent judicial one to get to the bottom of the specific revelations and allegations. It will look at why the police investigation that started in 2006 failed, and at what was going on at the News of the World and at other newspapers. The remit of the second inquiry will be to look at the wider lessons for the future of the press, and we intend that work can start at the earliest opportunity, ideally this summer. There will surely be further details on these inquiries, which will be announced in due time.
BSkyB
Debate between Baroness O'Neill of Bengarve and Baroness Rawlings
Lord Puttnam
My Lords, is the Minister having a conversation with her noble friend the Justice Minister, who is sitting at her side, and with the noble Lord, Lord Crickhowell, who is sitting behind her, to confirm that if she or her colleagues in another place check the record, they will discover that during the passage of the 2003 Act this exact clause was discussed in detail? The type of eventuality that we are dealing with today was anticipated and this clause was intended to deal with it. To ignore that is an abrogation of the will of Parliament.
Baroness Rawlings
The noble Lord, Lord Puttnam, makes a valid point. The Enterprise Act 2002 sets out the due process, which is that the Culture Secretary has to make a quasi-judicial decision on the impact of the proposed merger on media plurality issues alone. That was said by the right honourable Member in the other place, Mr Vince Cable, and that is what is happening. The decision will be made after Ofcom and the OFT have made their decisions.
Baroness O'Neill of Bengarve
Does the Minister agree that the Prime Minister said yesterday that there would be one or two inquiries, not reviews? Does she agree that those inquiries should be chaired by a judge and that they should have the power to subpoena documents and take evidence under oath?
Baroness Rawlings
My Lords, it would seem that that is necessary. However, at the moment there are several inquires going on and the Prime Minister’s reviews or inquiries will happen afterwards. I am sure that the noble Baroness is right in that they will probably have a judge but at this stage I cannot give her the details.