Wales: Constitutional and Policy Divergence

Debate between Baroness Goldie and Lord Katz

Wednesday 4th November 2026 Lords Chamber

[Lord Katz (Lab)]

I agree with the sentiment that the noble Baroness has expressed. Last week at the National Economic Council, the Prime Minister set out an offer on empowering local regions to deliver good growth and thus develop better public services to prevent Wales maintaining its position as highly centralised. This involves all sorts of things, such as devolving more employment support on the condition that it reaches down into Wales’s regions and communities and exploring how we can improve city region deals. Constitutionally, we need to carry on talking respectfully to all our partners in Governments across the United Kingdom. The Prime Minister is looking forward to Cardiff hosting the next meeting of the National Economic Council next spring. I am sure that these discussions will continue.

[Baroness Goldie (Con)]

My Lords, the noble Baroness, Lady Wilcox, is absolutely right in advancing the test, as she does, of the quality of public services delivered. The experience in Scotland is sad and instructive. After 21 years of SNP incumbency, we have had a relentless prosecution of the case for independence—rejected by the Scottish electorate—and a cataclysmic decline in public services, while being the highest-taxed part of the United Kingdom. Can the Minister reassure this House that his Government will take steps to ensure that Administrations in the devolved parts of this nation are concentrating exclusively on the services they are supposed to deliver for their electorates?

[Lord Katz (Lab)]

I agree completely with the noble Baroness. I am absolutely clear that the UK Labour Government were elected with a mandate to defend and strengthen our union, including in both Wales and Scotland—that is what we are doing now and will continue to do. We will never support independence. On her comments about looking out for the people of the respective nations, whether in Wales, as originally posed in the Question, or in Scotland, we are clear that nations and Governments need to focus on what is best for the people. We are very pleased that the Welsh Government have decided to follow the UK Government’s lead in passing on the £100 household energy payment that was announced in last week’s Budget. We are also clear that, when we are giving record funding settlements, as we are to Wales, the devolved Administrations need to focus on spending them on public services that improve the lives of their citizens, not spend all their time on constitutional questions.