UN Mission in Mali: Armed Forces Deployment

Debate between Baroness Goldie and Lord Hain

Monday 14th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Goldie (Con)]

I slightly missed a bit in the middle of the noble Viscount’s question, but I will try to deal with the overall concept of his question as to what we are doing in the Sahel. Our objectives are to contribute to improving the situation. We recognise a number of different actors already present in the Sahel. We aim to work with them to better deliver for the people of the region. The UK’s deployment to MINUSMA is a vital part of our work in the Sahel to build stability, bolster conflict resolution, improve the humanitarian response and strengthen partnerships between the international community and regional Governments.

[Lord Hain (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I agree with the Minister that this is an important UN mission that we must support. I associate myself with my noble friend Lord Touhig’s remarks. The Sahel region is beset by an increasingly dangerous and violent Islamist insurgency, and in the east of Mali militants repeatedly attack French, European and local armed forces, including 50 killed in 2017 in a suicide attack on a military base. The Minister said that lessons had been learned from previous missions. How certain can she be that Mali will be very different from, for example, Helmand? I clearly recall similar assurances to those she has given being given to us in the Cabinet in 2006 on a straightforward mission, yet 454 soldiers, including British ones, were subsequently killed in combat operations against the Taliban.

[Baroness Goldie (Con)]

That was indeed a very sad outcome. It is one we remain mindful of, and that we cannot and will not forget. The answer to the noble Lord’s question is probably best explained by returning to the role of the United Nations, because this is what we are part of. The United Kingdom believes in peacekeeping as a way to stabilise and contain conflict. Our contribution to MINUSMA, alongside our enduring commitment to the United Nations’ peacekeeping operation in, for example, Cyprus, and the staff officers we have employed in other operations, is the UK playing its part in a multinational effort to contain the worst consequences of violent conflict and to help build confidence in the political processes.

As I said, we constantly assess and after 18 months we will review this mission. We will analyse what has been happening and assess our role as a contributor to the mission. The noble Lord is right to be alert to what we must always be on our guard against. We want to be very sure that our presence is positive and that the contribution we make makes a difference to providing a more positive future for Mali. That is something we will constantly keep under consideration.

Syria

Debate between Baroness Goldie and Lord Hain

Tuesday 13th September 2016 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Goldie]

All I can say in response to the noble Lord’s question is that this deal, this agreement, has been universally welcomed. It is a start to what we hope is something better. We have all observed with desperate concern the appalling plight of hundreds of thousands of people in Syria. All I can say to the noble Lord is that it is a start and, as I said in response to an earlier question, it is a foundation on which, if enduring, we can build. The future we want is a transformation of Syria into a modernised, peaceful, stable country where citizens feel safe and free.

[Lord Hain (Lab)]

I challenge the noble Baroness’s statement that Assad must stand down, stated in advance. There is no question but that he is a barbaric dictator, one who has acted unspeakably, but Northern Ireland, among other experiences, shows that you do not set preconditions for negotiations: if you do, they never occur. Why would the Government of Syria come to the negotiating table if a precondition from the UK and others was that their president could not continue?

[Baroness Goldie]

I did not say he should stand down now; I said that the United Kingdom Government’s view has been consistent: we do not consider that he can be part of the long-term future in Syria. It is important that he contemplates stepping down to create a credible political transition. With his presence, there is a distracting and potentially divisive influence that will hardly be conducive to achieving the peace and stability which everyone wants for the citizens of Syria.