Care Sector

Baroness Gardner of Parkes Excerpts

Tuesday 25th November 2014 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Gardner of Parkes (Con)]

My Lords, I am very grateful to the noble Baroness, Lady Kingsmill, for bringing up this subject. It is something in which I have taken an interest for some time.

I am not a qualified solicitor, but I sat for many years as a lay member on industrial tribunals, which are now of course called employment tribunals. I was therefore fascinated when it was mentioned how badly paid these people were, with no pay for their travel time between jobs. A noble Lord who spoke earlier said that they should take their case to an employment tribunal, and that without doubt the employment tribunal would give them the right to be paid. That is all very well, except that all these people are working as individuals, usually for an agency, and the agency determines everything.

I have been trying to help a particular woman who has worked for many years caring for elderly people, usually for five, six, seven years. She has just finished seven years with someone who died in their 90s. When they died, the son came over from America and said, “We will not need you any more now she is dead”. He never offered to pay a penny of notice or said anything to her whatsoever. He just vanished, and she was left with nothing. I have spoken about this to various people in this House, such as the noble Lord, Lord Whitty. He said, “She must have had a contract of employment”. There was no contract of employment, as she was considered self-employed. The elderly lady had someone else to care for her five days a week and this carer’s responsibility was to go in on Friday night and stay through till Monday morning. I worked out that that was 48 hours or more. She was paid £100. It turned out that was around only £2 an hour—I had to use my calculator—for two full days in which she had to get up many times during the night to look after that woman. One talks about people being vulnerable, but a lot of old people also get very difficult. This was such a case. But this carer is such a caring person that she would say, “She does not mean to be difficult”. The carer really did her best for this woman.

Having lost that last person, the carer decided she would join a system that the councils use, whereby they are associated with a particular employment agency. I did a lot of phoning to various employment agencies to see which would be a good one to go to. The differences that came up were quite interesting. The important thing was that the workers had to have had training. The noble Baroness mentioned that there is no such thing as a national standard of training. There is none. When you ask the agencies, “What do you mean by training?”, they tell you, “You have got to pay for it,” and the carers pay from £25 to £40 for this. When the workers get the training, it is simply a bit of paper that applies to that particular agency. They cannot use it to go to any other agency. If they want to go to another agency, they have got to do that agency’s training. Someone here who does a lot to help people into employment said to me, “That is the way they lock them into that agency. If they have got to pay for new training, they are not going to leave their place of work, because that is the one that approves them”.

When I asked the agencies what things they trained their workers in, I was told they wanted to be sure a carer knows how to get a patient in and out of the bath, or how to cook a little meal—all the things that are practical. They only ask you in a written question what you would do in an emergency if, say, a person is unconscious on the floor. It seemed very unsatisfactory to me, to say the least.

They asked her to sign on with the company and I asked her to show me a copy of the paper. “They do not give you a copy”, was her reply. I told her to ask for a copy. How would she know what the conditions of work are otherwise? I then asked about travelling between jobs. The answer was that you are sent to client A for an hour and then you are sent to client B, but they might be an hour apart in travel terms. There is no pay at all for the travelling time. I have spoken to local authorities about this in a meeting in one of the Committee Rooms. They said that they should not really be using these agencies unless they know that they are paying proper wages.

Time is running out because I have only six minutes in which to speak, unlike the wonderful speech we have just heard. I come to the most important thing, and it is worth spending the last minute on it. We need a nationally recognised standard of training. The training should not be too complicated or difficult for people to achieve, but it should cover the essentials. Someone with the qualification should be able to go anywhere in the country, and it should be accepted. That would be a great help.

There is a great deal to this subject. I am a retired dentist. No one can just help out in a dentist’s surgery any more. The staff all have to be fully and extensively trained. Every field in care or health requires training that is recognised nationally, and that is what we need in this sector. When we have that, it will mean that we would be able to help the very large number of people who are going to need care in the future.