Leveson Inquiry
Debate between Baroness Garden of Frognal and Lord Myners(12 years, 7 months ago)
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Baroness Garden of Frognal
My understanding is that in this case the special adviser was one of a number of people, including officials, who had particular roles in respect to the BSkyB bid—but I hear what my noble friend says and if there are matters I can write to him on, I will do so.
Lord Myners
My Lords, while the House has very many concerns about plurality and media ownership, the issue here is a very narrow and precise one. It is about ministerial accountability and compliance with ministerial regulations and the code. This is not to be left to Leveson, who will take a long time and no doubt do a very good job. This is a Secretary of State whom I hold in high regard—I have been very impressed by the way in which Mr Hunt has conducted his affairs, particularly in support of arts institutions—but the simple fact is that there was a complete breakdown of control within DCMS and for that the Secretary of State, who appointed the special adviser, must take entire responsibility. I cannot believe that there was not daily contact between Mr Adam Smith and the Secretary of State and, as we have seen from the e-mails, decisions to be announced by the Minister were disclosed to News Corporation in advance—textually precisely accurately. This is also a breach of Financial Services Authority regulations, which the Permanent Secretary of DCMS should immediately investigate and report to the FSA. Will the noble Baroness confirm that that will be done, and explain why the Secretary of State is not taking responsibility for the people he appointed and who reported to him?
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My right honourable friend in the other place this morning pointed out that he had a number of people in the department working for him to whom he gave responsibility for particular tasks, and he did not then monitor them in precise detail—but I hear what the noble Lord says.
London Olympic Games and Paralympic Games (Amendment) Bill
Debate between Baroness Garden of Frognal and Lord Myners
Lord Myners
Before my noble friend finishes, can we ask the Minister to say a little more about the one-day travelcards as I think it may well be the first time that this has been announced? Am I correct in understanding that, as my noble friend says, these are for London travel but that they will cover travel for the journey to and back from the Games, that they will apply to wherever the traveller travels from, and that they will be free? If they are not free, then they are just a return ticket, and not a travelcard at all, so can the Minister confirm what exactly these travelcards cover and will they apply to people going to Weymouth to see the sailing, or to Greenwich to see the equestrian events? Can the Minister be more precise please?
Baroness Garden of Frognal
All spectators will receive a free all-zones travelcard for the day of their Games event ticket, so that will cover the London venues. A dedicated Games journey planner on the London 2012 website will enable ticket holders to plan and book their journeys well in advance of the Games. We are hoping that the all-zones travelcard will be an additional encouragement to the spectators to use public transport.
Media: News Corporation
Debate between Baroness Garden of Frognal and Lord Myners
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My understanding is that Lord Justice Leveson will have the capacity to make that part of the inquiry. If I am wrong on that, I will come back to the noble Baroness.
There will also be recommendations on how future concerns about press behaviour, media policy, regulation and cross-media ownership should be dealt with by all the relevant authorities whether that is Parliament, government, the prosecuting authorities or the police.
The Deputy Prime Minister recently clearly set out the three guiding principles for future reform—my answer to the noble Baroness, Lady Kennedy, is yes. First, the freedom of the press is vital and that liberty and democracy are founded on freedom of expression. We have heard from all sides of the Chamber today how important your Lordships feel that freedom of expression and the freedom of the press are. Secondly, our media must be held to account ensuring they act within the bounds of the law and decent behaviour, with politicians and police equally accountable for their role. Thirdly, our free, accountable press must be plural, guaranteeing healthy competition and diverse debate. We have had inputs in the debate today from so many noble Lords who have first-hand experience of the press, all of whom made valuable contributions to the matters under discussion.
I now turn to BSkyB. As we know, News Corporation has withdrawn its bid to purchase the remaining 61 per cent of shares in BSkyB which it does not already own. This is a decision taken by News Corporation but, of course, it will have been aware of the strength of concern from both Parliament and the public about the bid and the circumstances surrounding it.
I want to make the point that the Culture Secretary has at all times sought and followed advice from the Office of Fair Trading and Ofcom, the independent and expert regulators. He has been as transparent as possible, publishing much more than required to do so by legislation and ensuring that he acted within the law. But of course I take note of the comments made by the noble and learned Baroness, Lady Scotland, in connection with that.
The future for News International in the UK is a matter for News International. The nature of our press at the moment is that anyone can start or run a newspaper and we do not impose any licensing scheme. This freedom means that, as well as our national newspapers, we have a great many smaller and more eccentric publications. We welcome the partisan approach that newspapers take but the key point for every publication—no matter how big or small—is that it must abide by the law of the land. We expect our newspapers to be truthful, not to mislead us and to observe standards of decent behaviour. The inquiry that is now under way will look at ways of ensuring that newspapers do that in future. Once again, as various noble Lords have reminded us, most journalists and people who work on newspapers are honourable and professional.
It has been disturbing to hear of the involvement of the police and we have heard some extraordinary things from the Met this week. We have had inputs from my noble friend Lady Doocey, the noble Lord, Lord Imbert, and others who have spoken about police involvement. Again, I echo their words of support for the courage and professionalism of the vast majority of people who work in the police force. We understand that the media and the police need to have a good working relationship. It is, for the most part, a mutually beneficial relationship but allegations have been made during this scandal that some corrupt police officers may have taken payments from newspapers in exchange for access to privileged information. These allegations have undermined that relationship, fractured public trust and led to a belief that that relationship can be too close.
The Metropolitan Police are as determined as we are that these police officers should be identified and referred to a fully independent investigation that will be convened by the Independent Police Complaints Commission. Additionally, the Home Secretary has commissioned a report from the Independent Police Complaints Commission on its experience of investigating corruption in the police service which will identify what lessons the police can learn through this affair.
The Prime Minister also reported on Wednesday that Sir Paul Stephenson is looking to invite a senior public figure to advise him on interaction with the media and the ethics that should underpin his force, including advising on how to ensure maximum transparency and public confidence, and how arrangements are working. We understand that the commissioner has committed to putting in place a system of recording and making available to the public the contacts of Metropolitan Police officers with journalists.
It is clear that the press will be under closer scrutiny than ever before, and we heartily welcome the inquiry led by Lord Leveson and wish him well as he begins his work. We would advise him, as my noble friend Lord Fowler has said, to use the great expertise in this House, including that which we have heard today in this debate.
Picking up on one or two points from the debate, as we came into the Chamber, the breaking news was of the resignation of Rebekah Brooks. Obviously, that is a matter for her and for News International but we do not see any reason why her resignation should interfere with her co-operation with next week’s culture Select Committee, the forthcoming inquiry or with ongoing police investigations.
The noble Lord, Lord Prescott, referred to the Metropolitan Police’s employment of Neil Wallis who was arrested yesterday. The Home Secretary is concerned about his employment and she is looking into the facts of that case. The noble Baroness, Lady O’Neill, and the noble Lord, Lord Davies, referred to privacy. A joint parliamentary committee is being set up to look at the issues that came out of the debate on super-injunctions and privacy. How that committee will work with the inquiry by Lord Leveson is a matter for them but it is an issue that has been taken up and action is being taken.
The noble Lord, Lord Davies, asked what is to happen while we wait for the outcome of the inquiry. The PCC is still in place, of course, and we heard from the noble Lord, Lord Grade, about its valuable work. However, we have also heard of other aspects from other noble Lords. The press is certainly aware of the much closer public scrutiny that it will now be undergoing, so we hope that, together, they will influence moves towards a more honourable press.
The noble Baroness, Lady Kennedy, mentioned the inquiry being conducted by Deputy Assistant Commissioner Sue Akers and expressed concerns about the level of resources it would receive. We understand that it is for the commissioner to decide the level of resources, but the Prime Minister has been personally assured by the commissioner that the investigation is fully resourced and that it will be thorough and robust. We understand that currently around 45 officers and staff have been assigned to it.
The noble Lord, Lord Myners, asked whether the Communications Act 2003 will be revisited. I can assure him that work is already under way and that new legislation will be brought forward in the future.
This has been an intense and rich debate, but if I have overlooked any questions or matters for reply, I apologise. I shall certainly endeavour to write to noble Lords—
Lord Myners
Perhaps I may ask one question before the noble Baroness reverts to her prepared text. I think that only one question was directly addressed to the Minister in the whole debate, and that was from my noble and learned friend Lady Scotland. It was about the future recording of contacts between Ministers and the press. Does the Minister agree that it was most unwise of the Prime Minister to accept hospitality and gifts from Ms Brooks over Christmas when one of his colleagues was involved in a judicial review of her employer? Does she also agree that the holding of a meeting in a flat above No. 10 does not render it a meeting that should not be recorded because it was held on private premises? Does she further agree that, in future, the Government need to be much more open about their own contacts with the press?
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My Lords, at this stage I would not wish to comment on the particular issues that the noble Lord has raised, but I can assure him that government Ministers have now all been asked to log their contacts with the media. That is ongoing, so for the future that should all be in place. If there is anything more to add, I shall write to noble Lords. I must apologise, as I am clutching a piece of paper to reply to this point. It would have been extremely remiss of me to sit down having left the question unanswered. Again, I apologise.
I thank all noble Lords who have contributed to the debate. It has been in the best traditions of your Lordships’ House. It was considered, incisive, informed and passionate, and the contributions have added a great deal to the national debate. All sides of the House have expressed the will to work together in this instance with, as the noble Baroness, Lady Royall, said, singleness of purpose. That message was echoed by her colleague, the noble and learned Baroness, Lady Scotland. All sides would wish that to be the case because we all have much to gain from the resolution of the unhappy matters that have been going on recently.
My final thanks add to those made to my noble friend Lord Fowler for bringing this debate about. We wish him every success in his continued endeavours.
Media: Ownership
Debate between Baroness Garden of Frognal and Lord Myners
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My Lords, a great degree of independence is built in to the decisions that are taken. My noble friend is absolutely right: it is the Secretary of State who will ultimately take the decision, but it will be based on wide-ranging consultation, and will have the agreement of Ofcom and the other bodies that regulate the media.
Lord Myners
My Lords, I am sure that the Secretary of State will come to regret the very unconventional route by which he has approached this, which has not exposed this very complicated but important matter to a full competition inquiry. However, if the Secretary of State persists in his plan, can he at least give an assurance that the independent directors will be truly independent, the shareholders will not be under any influence from Murdoch and, indeed, that the company will remain an independent company and not see its other shares acquired by a party sympathetic to Murdoch?
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My Lords, the independence of the shareholders and the fact that they will not all be members of the Murdoch family are written into the undertakings. The competition aspects were ruled on by the EU Commission, so at the moment issues of plurality rather than competition are to be discussed. However, if the Secretary of State has any misgivings, he can refer the matter to the Competition Commission.