Easter Recess: Government Update

Debate between Baroness Evans of Bowes Park and Lord Butler of Brockwell

Monday 25th April 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Evans of Bowes Park (Con)]

I thank the noble Viscount and will make a couple of broader comments. There will be a NATO summit in June, at which NATO will agree a new strategic concept to set the direction of the alliance for the next decade and long-term changes to our deterrence and defence posture in response to Russia’s invasion of Ukraine. There is action at that level looking towards the future.

The noble Viscount will be aware that the international community has committed to widening its package of military support for Ukraine and exploring new ways of sustaining the Ukrainian armed forces over the longer term. I can reassure him that many conversations are going on internationally, and with President Zelensky and his Administration, to make sure we all come together and work to help rebuild Ukraine and provide it with the support it wants and is asking for. We are very cognisant of wanting to make sure we deliver what it needs at each given point. We hope that military hostilities will finish, but focus is on that element and the support we can provide there at the moment. However, we will of course move to reconstruction and helping ensure that Ukraine can get back on its feet as quickly as possible following—we hope—the end of hostilities.

[Lord Butler of Brockwell (CB)]

My Lords, I will refer to the first part of the Prime Minister’s Statement. It will be understood how distressing it has been for those of us for whom it was the greatest privilege of our lives to work in 10 Downing Street in support of the Heads of our Governments to hear the accounts of what went on there during the regulations over Covid. I revert to a question I raised with the Leader in her initial Statement about Sue Gray’s preliminary report. In the reset of 10 Downing Street, who will have overall responsibility for staff management, both civil servants and special advisers? Despite their titles, I do not think it will be the chief of staff or even the deputy chief of staff, but it really will have to be somebody if any recurrence is to be prevented of behaviour which has been so damaging to the Government.

[Baroness Evans of Bowes Park (Con)]

Samantha Jones, the permanent secretary and chief operating officer, will be in charge of civil servants in No. 10. As the noble Lord will know, the Ministerial Code states:

“The responsibility for the management and conduct of special advisers, including discipline, rests with the Minister who made the appointment.”


There is experience within No. 10 to draw on. There is specialist HR experience from the Cabinet Office’s spad HR team to support that role. I believe the chief of staff and the deputy chief of staff will also play a role in that regard.

Sue Gray Report

Debate between Baroness Evans of Bowes Park and Lord Butler of Brockwell

Monday 31st January 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Evans of Bowes Park (Con)]

I certainly agree with my noble friend that there should be no finger-pointing. As the Prime Minister said, we need to look in the mirror and learn for ourselves. However, I would push back slightly on my noble friend’s characterisation of special advisers, not least because I am married to a former one. That is not a fair assertion across the piece. There are of course things we need to learn and ways in which we need to work better. This Statement makes that clear, and we now all need to work together and move forward to make sure we can implement the changes that are needed, in order to ensure that lessons are learned from what we have discovered.

[Lord Butler of Brockwell (CB)]

My Lords, I do not fully recognise the picture portrayed by the noble Lord, Lord Forsyth, in relation to myself, but I am deeply saddened by the portrait of 10 Downing Street in Sue Gray’s report. I welcome the proposal to create a Permanent Secretary post to lead No. 10. Can the noble Baroness assure us that this will be a permanent Civil Service post with unambiguous authority over both special advisers and civil servants?

[Baroness Evans of Bowes Park (Con)]

I am afraid that the noble Lord may have gone a few steps ahead of what I am able to say today. This is a commitment to create an office of the Prime Minister with a Permanent Secretary to lead No. 10. No doubt there will be a lot of discussions, including with distinguished people who have expertise in this area, such as the noble Lord himself, to make sure that we get the right structure going forward, which is something we all want to achieve.