President of Iran: Death

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Wednesday 22nd May 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I never see the noble Lord in the way that he describes himself. The challenges that any Minister faces from him in your Lordships’ Chamber are regarded with great respect. I welcome his insights. I assure him that the lessons of history inform the policies and programmes that the Government undertake. Both our personal as well as our professional experience lead us to ensure that we do not forget the lessons of history.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

Does the Minister share my dismay that our representative at the United Nations stood in tribute to the death of the person who is now called the “Butcher of Tehran”? Will he ensure that all our actions in the United Nations are designed to keep Iran in its proper place, and not, for example, chairing committees on human rights and women, et cetera?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I assure the noble Baroness, as I am sure she recognises, of the action that the Government have taken. It was the United Kingdom, together with the US, that led the campaign to ensure that Iran was removed, for example, from CEDAW, an organisation very much focused on the rights of women. We remain focused in that respect.

Israel and Gaza

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Wednesday 22nd May 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

My Lords, will the Minister take the opportunity to clear up some of the misinformation that is being put out, not least, I am sorry to say, by the BBC? For example, there are already 142 states that recognise Palestine and it has not made a scrap of difference. Humanitarian aid is being sent in but it is not being distributed, or it is being stolen by Hamas and sold. Even the United Nations has now admitted that the casualty figures relating to women and children should be halved—we have been given false casualty figures. Finally, I am puzzled by the way that we put Israel under a microscope but no one has anything to say about the hundreds of thousands of people who have died recently in Congo, in Yemen, in Syria and all over the place, without any concern, it seems, for their humanitarian aid.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, on the noble Baroness’s last point, I disagree with her. On Yemen, we have announced additional funding of £139 million. On Syria, we have announced further funding of £89 million, so we are very much seized of the humanitarian plight of those suffering across the region. On Congo, the situation is desperate. I myself visited Congo with Her Royal Highness the Duchess of Edinburgh on the prevention of sexual violence in conflict, so the noble Baroness is wrong to say that. I cannot speak for others, nor will I: I speak for the British Government and our country. We are very much focused on that.

On the casualty figures, yes, the UN revised them because they are based on casualties that it is now finding. I fear, and I do not want to add to speculation, that we need to make a full assessment on the ground. I agree with the noble Baroness inasmuch as we need to have these figures established and verified. To do that, we need the UN agencies and we need the verification process to take place, because what is undoubtedly true is that much of Gaza is currently in ruins and we need to ensure that those souls who have been buried under that are given dignity.

At the same time, I recognise that we hold Israel to a high standard because it is a democracy with a rule of law. We do not have the same standard for Hamas. It is a terrorist group. When we hold Israel to account, we do so as a friend and constructive partner. It is important that we continue to focus on that.

On recognition, and I am sure the noble Baroness will, on reflection, agree with me, I have said repeatedly that stability, security and peace will be possible only once there is stability, security and peace for Israelis and Palestinians alike.

Israel and Gaza

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Tuesday 7th May 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My noble friend has articulated the Government’s approach extremely well. That is exactly what I assure all noble Lords that the Foreign Secretary and I are working on.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

My Lords, on the topic of international law, will the Minister remind Egypt of its obligations under the refugee convention to accept such refugees as make their way across the border, rather than beating them back? Will he also set aside the misguided, misinformed statement by—shamefully—some former members of the Supreme Court that it was plausible that Israel was committing genocide? That allegation must be put to rest.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, on the second point, the Government’s position is well known: genocide determination is a matter for the courts. We remind all sides, including partners, friends and allies in the region, of the importance of adhering to international humanitarian law obligations.

Israel and Gaza

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Tuesday 26th March 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

On the noble Lord’s second point, about threatening to withhold arms exports, I do not believe I have said that. On his earlier point, I am sorry, but I do not agree with him. As we have seen directly through the exchanges we have had with COGAT, there has been a real challenge. British trucks with British aid have been waiting on the borders of Gaza. He quoted the numbers; I quoted greater numbers than he did. We have seen a change—an uptick, but it is a small uptick—in the number of trucks entering; perhaps he has not visited to see the backlog of trucks. Let us be clear what has happened in Gaza. There is no infrastructure. The UN itself is not getting the visas it needs. The noble Lord shakes his head, but this is fact. We have been lobbying on this and this is our advocacy.

We have a very strong relationship with Israel. When Mr Gantz visited London, the Foreign Secretary and I made clear the importance of this issue, and Israel recognises its responsibilities. It is a democracy and it has international obligations, including adherence to international humanitarian law. Because of the advocacy of countries such as the United Kingdom, we see that there has been some movement. We have seen an increase in aid going in, but this is not enough. We have looked in detail at the 500 or 600 trucks. Let us also be clear: certain produce was produced in Gaza and that is no longer happening. What is needed right now, as the report we discussed only a few days ago made clear, is to avert a humanitarian famine, and Israel has an important role to play in this.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

My Lords, does the Minister appreciate that the Security Council has turned into a completely dysfunctional organisation? It rejected a resolution a couple of days ago that would have linked the release of the hostages to a ceasefire. It turned that down. This time, the two conditions are not linked, and they are not enforceable. It is no more possible to enforce the release of hostages than it is to enforce a ceasefire against Hamas, which was not mentioned in that resolution. Will the Minister push for the Red Cross to be allowed to visit the hostages and for the hostages to be released first? Will he also note that the news we are getting from Gaza is almost totally unreliable, because so much of it comes from journalists who are controlled by or in the pocket of Hamas? Will he focus on the hostages? I am sad to say how empty is that phrase: never again.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I am sad to say that I disagree with the noble Baroness. First, of course I am focused on the hostages. I have met with the relatives of hostages not once, twice or three times, but several times over. In my Statement, I spoke about the importance of recognising their suffering. I met with a hostage’s mother only last week, as did the Foreign Secretary. The premise of saying that we are not focused on the hostages, frankly, does not add up.

Secondly, I do not agree with the noble Baroness’s assessment of the UN Security Council. Yes, it has been challenging but what we saw yesterday was the Security Council coming together. On her earlier point, let me read from the Security Council resolution, which I have in front of me. It refers to:

“Acknowledging the ongoing diplomatic efforts by Egypt, Qatar and the United States, aimed at reaching a cessation of hostilities, releasing the hostages and increasing the provision and distribution of humanitarian aid”.


It contains three provisions. The first:

“Demands an immediate ceasefire for the month of Ramadan respected by all parties leading to a … sustainable ceasefire, and also demands the immediate and unconditional release of … hostages, as well as ensuring humanitarian access”.


I invite the noble Baroness and noble Lords to read the resolution, which is very clear.

Occupied Palestinian Territories: Humanitarian Situation

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Thursday 9th November 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I agree with the noble Baroness about the phenomenal role that aid workers, agencies and doctors are playing on the ground. I know that some British doctors are still serving in the hospitals under such intense pressures; I pay tribute to them. There are doctors lining up to go into Gaza to provide support.

I also agree with the noble Baroness that we need to take stock of the human tragedy unfolding in Gaza. It is for us all not just to contemplate but to act upon. That is why the nature of the cessation required needs to ensure that support can get in, but it must also be done in a safe and secure manner. If we look at the example of the field facilities we are discussing with partners, including field hospitals within Gaza, they must satisfy the issues of security for Israel and for those working there. The access and supply routes should be equally secured. Those are some of the key priorities we are currently working on.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

My Lords, I call on the Minister to make his first port of call the international Red Cross, whose job it is to take care of hostages. If it gets out the hostages and Hamas comes out from hiding behind civilians, the temperature will cool. It is also the job of the surrounding Middle East countries—among the richest countries in the world—to come to the aid of the Palestinians, not least through Egypt opening the border. But first, the hostages.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I assure the noble Baroness—I have said this before about the hostages—that we are working with many of the countries she highlights. Qatar, for example, as the noble Baroness will know, is playing a key role in this respect. That is a key focus for us in our priorities. There are three areas. We want those who need to leave Gaza to leave, the hostages to be released and the aid to go in. Those three things require that we work towards ensuring that the conditions on the ground sustain that. Let me reassure the noble Baroness, in terms of not just the hostage release but the future, that the near neighbours to Israel need to play a role as partners in peace. I can assure the noble Baroness that, from our conversations and the discussions and diplomatic engagement we are having, they are very seized of that priority.

Polish Jewish Holocaust Victims: Stolen Property

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Wednesday 25th October 2023 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Deech]

To ask His Majesty’s Government what is their assessment of progress made at the International Terezin Declaration Conference in November 2022 towards securing from the government of Poland (1) restitution, (2) compensation, or (3) commemoration, of property stolen from Polish Jewish victims of the Holocaust.

[The Minister of State, Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, it is this Government’s assessment that there has been no progress on these important issues in Poland itself following legislation passed in 2020 which closed the door to any restitution or compensation claims. However, we continue to urge the Polish Government to take steps to ensure that claims are addressed. My noble friend Lord Pickles, the UK Special Envoy for Post-Holocaust Issues, raised this in a meeting with the Polish ambassador on 3 August. He will raise it again during his visit to Poland this week.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

Continuing the theme of breaches of human rights, Poland is the only modern European country not to fulfil its moral and legal duty in relation to property. I have been asking this question for 14 years: asking the Government to take action on behalf of thousands of dispossessed victims, both Jewish and non-Jewish, and Poland has responded by putting more and more obstacles in the way of claims by legislating against them and even making it an offence to discuss Poland’s involvement—if it was—in the Holocaust. New Prime Minister Tusk promises to restore the rule of law and take Poland forward to liberal democracy, so, rather than just attending conferences with supporters, will the Government reopen direct negotiations with Prime Minister Tusk and raise at the Council of Europe Poland’s human rights failure to honour the obligation to restore property? It is a stain on Poland’s record.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, the noble Baroness will also recognise, as I did when I was preparing for this particular Question, exactly how her sentiments were similar to my sentiments, in that I have had to respond on a number of occasions in different ministerial portfolios on this question. The new Government are being formed. Obviously, the results are still being taken forward and different parties and alliances are coming together. The clear indication is very much that Mr Tusk may well emerge in forming the new Government. We will of course continue to prioritise it.

I would say to the noble Baroness that it is not just about attending meetings or conferences. The noble Baroness will know of the direct leadership of my noble friend on this issue. We take a strong stand on the issue of property restitution, in line with our unwavering commitment to supporting Holocaust survivors and families, and we will continue to do so in the months and years ahead.

Global Health Policies

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Monday 30th January 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I meant this current year and next year. That is why I can assure the noble Lord that within the scope of the decisions being made, the issue of girls and women is a key priority, and rightly so.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

My Lords, does the Minister feel at all inhibited in calls for his international leadership by the fact that our own health system is failing in so many ways? In particular, we are drawing in nurses and doctors from countries that need them much more than we do.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, the noble Baroness raises a point about health recruitment. We are committed to working with the likes of the World Health Organization, which is governed by a strict UK practice for international recruitment, including a ban on direct recruitment for countries that the World Health Organization deems to have the weakest health systems. I agree with the noble Baroness, notwithstanding what I have just said, We work with particular countries to ensure that those who are recruited from those countries have an opportunity to return. For example, in India, we are looking at the opportunity to take advantage of studying medicine in the UK and working within the NHS in the UK; but within the scope of that, after the practical and academic experience, the individuals can return to healthcare in India. These are the innovative ways in which we need to work with other countries to ensure that we get the kind of universal healthcare coverage that is required.

Shireen Abu Aqla

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Tuesday 17th May 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, in joining my noble friend in prayers for the family of Shireen Abu Aqla, I am sure that I speak for all Members of your Lordships’ House, irrespective of what our positions are or where the Government or anyone else may stand, when I say that while we ultimately seek and hope for peace and security for all, I condemn any shocking or tragic death and express our solidarity with those who suffer the tragedy of such actions. This underlines the importance of achieving a resolution to the conflict. It is important that we strive to find peace in the Holy Land.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

My Lords, it is sad but not surprising that the general opinion piles in to find that Israel is guilty before any investigation is carried out. Will the Minister encourage the Palestinians to hand over the relevant evidence—I believe it is a bullet, and we hope that it will be the right one—for investigation? Will he also encourage the Palestinians to stop their “pay for slay” policy whereby the families of assassins who are in prison are given salaries? That would be one way to cut down the amount of tragic bloodshed in that area.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, on the tragic killing of Shireen Abu Aqla, it is important that we have made the UK’s position clear. Indeed, on 13 May, with other members of the UN Security Council, we not only condemned the killing but stressed the importance of an

“immediate, thorough, transparent, fair and impartial investigation”

and the need to ensure accountability. In this respect, anyone who has evidence in support of such an investigation needs to bring that forward. It is also important to say that no one who commits these acts achieves any goal towards the important path of peace. What we need at this time is reflection on the tragedy that continues to engulf all communities across Israel and the Palestinian territories but, equally, to ensure that the structures and justice systems act to bring justice for those who suffer as a consequence of these tragic acts.

UN Relief and Works Agency for Palestinian Refugees

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Thursday 9th December 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for his kind remarks. I share the point that he raises: as I said in an earlier answer, this has gone on for far too long; from both an Israeli and a Palestinian perspective, this needs resolution. I have been to Israel and the Palestinian territories. I have seen for myself the impact the conflict has on both communities. It requires peace negotiations to start again. We are encouraged by recent steps that the US has taken. The position has not changed on recognition of a Palestinian state: we will do so at a time when it serves the peace process in the best way. At the same time, we continue to support and work with the Palestinian Authority. For example, it was invited to, and attended, COP 26 recently.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

My Lords, the West has supported UNRWA financially for more than 70 years, contributing tens of billions of dollars towards not solving the refugee problem but perpetuating it. Is it not time that UNRWA’s functions were transferred to the United Nations refugee council and the Palestinian Authority for the proper treatment of refugees and their resettlement and advancement? UNRWA is a failure.

Palestine

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Wednesday 7th July 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con) [V]]

My Lords, we continue to work with key partners, including the US, which is of course very important for progress. We continue to engage with both sides, as I have articulated, but, equally, we are supporting efforts such as the work being done with UNRWA in supporting education and skills in the Palestinian Territories. It is important that we continue in that respect to provide hope for the future and the basis of a future independent and viable Palestinian state.

[Baroness Deech (CB) [V]]

Does the Minister agree with the opinion of our two most distinguished international lawyers, the late James Crawford and Professor Malcolm Shaw, in whose opinion Palestine is not a state under international law because it does not begin to conform to the criteria set out in the Montevideo convention? It does not have the right requirements to be a functioning lawful state.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con) [V]]

The Government’s position is very clear. We believe that the best and the only way to ensure peace in the region is to have two states side by side, and a Palestinian state must be viable. We continue to invest our efforts in making that issue a reality but, ultimately, it needs both sides to sit down and begin the negotiations so that we can see those two states living side by side in peace.

UN Peacebuilding Fund: Financial Support

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Thursday 10th June 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

Suffice it to say that I totally agree with my noble friend.

[Baroness Deech (CB) [V]]

On 1 June more than 60 parliamentarians signed a letter calling on the Government to support coexistence in the Middle East by committing to the International Fund for Israeli-Palestinian Peace. Given last month’s violence, surely this is the time to invest in peace and coexistence in the Middle East. Can my noble friend—the Minister—tell me whether the Government intend to support this fund and whether they will raise the issue at the G7?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I think the noble Baroness referred to me as her noble friend, and of course we are friends outside the Chamber, beyond the formalities. I can reassure her that the Middle East will be among the key areas of discussion, both bilaterally and collectively within the G7. I will write directly to the noble Baroness on the issue of the fund.

Prohibition of Nuclear Weapons

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Thursday 21st January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I assure my noble friend that on both his points we will be engaging constructively with the United States and other allies in this respect.

[Baroness Deech (CB) [V]]

My Lords, Iran has incrementally violated the JCPOA. It would be delusional to return to it and to drop sanctions. Iran has achieved uranium enrichment levels of 20%. What are the Government doing to ensure that Iran halts this dangerous escalation?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I assure the noble Baroness that Iran’s continued non-compliance with its nuclear commitments is deeply concerning and seriously undermines the non-proliferation benefits of the agreement. Iran faces a stark choice—to continue on its current path and face growing isolation or to come back to the negotiating table. We hope it will choose the latter course.

Foreign Policy: UK-EU Dialogue

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Thursday 14th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, my noble friend speaks from insight and experience and I listen carefully to his suggestions. Let me assure him that we are already working closely with EU colleagues. As the new relationship evolves, I am sure that we will look at how we can further strengthen co-operation on the very issues that he has outlined for reasons of proximity. As my right honourable friend the Prime Minister said, we want to be the best ally and the closest friend of the EU.

[Baroness Deech (CB) [V]]

My Lords, of course co-operation is a good thing, but now that we are free, we can diverge for the better and hope to persuade the EU to take a better path; for example, in relation to China. Only yesterday, we heard of the atrocities taking place there from the Conservative Party Human Rights Commission, but the EU has signed an investment agreement with China disregarding its crimes. Does the Minister agree that we must form an Anglo-American alliance and other alliances against Chinese atrocities and against buying Chinese-tainted goods and technology?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I agree with the noble Baroness’s point about creating alliances against the human rights abuses that we have seen in places such as Xinjiang and the continued suppression of democratic movements within Hong Kong, but it is not just about further strengthening our alliances with the US; it is about building international alliances and co-operation. Let me assure the noble Baroness that we are doing just that.

Iran: UN Arms Embargo

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Thursday 8th October 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I agree with my noble friend, and I have said repeatedly that our challenge and our opposition are not directed at the Iranian people. It is a rich culture, whether it is Persian, Arab, Turk, Baluch or Kurd—the list goes on. On his wider point about exports of arms to the region, when making any arms sales we engage one of the most rigid processes, and we ask other countries to adopt similar measures.

[Baroness Deech (CB) [V]]

My Lords, I refer to the Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action. There is no doubt that Iran has not observed it, and the United States has called for snapback sanctions. Will the Government comply with these, and how, otherwise, will they ensure that Iran’s nuclear ambitions are blocked?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I agree with the point made by the noble Baroness about ensuring that we curb Iran’s nuclear ambitions. That is why it is important that we keep the JCPOA—an imperfect agreement, I accept, but the only one on the table—and work to ensure that Iran adheres to it.

China: Uighur Internment Camps

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Wednesday 23rd September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, my noble friend raises an important point. She will also be aware that it was through our support and initiation of the Modern Slavery Act 2015 and our support for the evidence taken by a particular inquiry in Australia that we saw many companies changing their approach to trade initiatives, particularly in Xinjiang. We are looking at the US legislation carefully, and whatever the outcome of those discussions, I will write to my noble friend.

[Baroness Deech (CB) [V]]

My Lords, the tragedy of this is that we have seen it before—these steps towards genocide. It is even more tragic that the United Nations is impotent due to the position of China. The only thing I believe the Government can do is publish a list of those brands to which it is thought forced labour by the Uighurs is contributing and call on the population to boycott those brands and hopefully prevent their import.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I have already detailed the action the Government have taken, and I believe it is for companies to make their decisions in light of that evidence.

Terezin Declaration

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Monday 27th July 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Deech]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what progress they have made towards fulfilling their commitments as a party to the Terezin Declaration of 30 June 2009; and what discussions they have had with the government of Poland about the restitution of property seized from Polish Jewish citizens during the period of Nazi occupation.

[The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office and Department for International Development (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, the United Kingdom continues to meet its commitments to the Terezin declaration, particularly in Holocaust education and remembrance. We are in regular conversation with the Polish Government on the restitution of property seized during the Nazi occupation. The UK post-Holocaust issues envoy, my noble friend Lord Pickles, is working with the US and other parties to call on Poland to pass legislation to provide restitution of or compensation for private property.

[Baroness Deech (CB) [V]]

My Lords, I have been asking the same Question here for 11 years and getting the same response of no progress or promises. Poland is the only country in the EU that has not passed legislation to deal with one of the greatest thefts in history. Bills have been repeatedly introduced and withdrawn there, Bills that contained conditions that would have excluded the vast majority of Holocaust survivors. Will the Minister accept my proposal to follow the example of the American legislation called the Justice for Uncompensated Survivors Today Act, and secure an annual report to Parliament about the return of Jewish and non-Jewish property? Will he raise it at the Belvedere Forum every year? Will the UK use its position in the Council of Europe to press for a human rights agenda focusing on Poland and restitution, as required under the Universal Declaration of Human Rights?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, I acknowledge the noble Baroness’s question; I remember answering the first Question on this issue back in 2014. As the Human Rights Minister, I remain committed, along with my noble friend Lord Pickles and others, and I assure her that we continue to raise the issue regularly with Poland, bilaterally through our ambassador most recently, and in international for a—and I take on board the suggestion of the Council of Europe.

Israel: West Bank

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Wednesday 6th May 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, I agree with my noble friend on the vision and the courage of the sadly passed-away Prime Minister Rabin. He brought peace to the region and his vision is what is needed now. Of course, I support all negotiated settlements, and we call upon both sides to sit down together and reach an agreement that works for Israel and for the Palestinians.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

This proposal—so far it is only a proposal—over long-disputed territory has been taken out of context. I hope the Minister appreciates that. It relates to the Jordan valley, which has always been part of likely land swaps. It forms part of an overall vision to have a Palestinian state in the remainder of the West Bank and the Gaza Strip. The outright rejection of the entire US plan and adherence to past, failed plans are certain to condemn all sides to continued conflict. The Saudis have called on the Palestinian leadership to engage in direct negotiations with Israel on the merits of the US proposals. Can the Minister tell the House whether the UK Government have made representations to the Palestinian National Authority to do the same and get on with negotiations?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, I assure the noble Baroness that we implore both sides to sit down and negotiate so that an agreement can be reached in the interests of both peoples.

Israel Defense Forces

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Monday 8th July 2019 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, I have already made it clear that we have constantly and consistently raised the issue of the use of live ammunition against children with the Israeli authorities. The noble Baroness will also be aware that, during my last visit to Israel, I raised this issue directly when I met the Justice Minister, particularly the issue of children in detention. From the UK Government’s perspective, my honourable friend the new Minister for the Middle East recently made Israel and Palestine his first visit, during which he announced additional funding of £1.6 million to the World Health Organization, which will go towards alleviating humanitarian suffering, particularly in Gaza.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

Will the Minister equally disapprove of the way Hamas uses children? In Gaza recently, children were given the day off school and bussed to the fence. They were bribed and used as human shields. They have been used as suicide bombers, and rockets are deliberately placed in kindergartens. Does the blame not lie equally with Hamas, if not more so?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, anyone anywhere in the world who uses children as human shields or in such a despicable manner is to be condemned. I have consistently said that it is the Government’s position that the situation with Hamas cannot continue. Hamas failed to recognise the State of Israel, failed to negotiate and failed to recognise the right of Israel to exist. Let us get that on the table. Let us get the right of recognition of everyone in the region to exist and we will move forward practically and productively: we will save children’s lives, if it is done with the right ambition in mind.

United Nations Human Rights Council: Resolution on Gaza

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Monday 21st May 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, we made clear at the Human Rights Council the importance of any independent investigation. We sit on the Human Rights Council and we always stress the importance of co-operating, and we sought to do so. We did not vote against the resolution but abstained because we had reservations about the wording as it stood. We were not alone in that: I believe there was a total of 14 abstentions.

The noble Baroness asked about the Government’s position, which has been consistent. We want to see a resolution to the situation between Israel and the Palestinians, and we want to see an inquiry into the events that occurred last week in Gaza. Regrettably, children’s lives were lost. For that reason, we wanted to ensure that all material facts could be fully reviewed by any investigation that had been set up. We felt that the UN Human Rights Council resolution fell short of the requirement to ensure that any factors from the side of Hamas inciting others to act in this way were going to be fully considered. That was regrettable, and that is why the UK Government abstained from voting for the resolution.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

Does the Minister recall that, only just over a year ago, the Government announced that they were putting the United Nations Human Rights Council on notice for its disproportionate focus on Israel? It is a council that contains countries not noted for their support of human rights, such as Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, Qatar and Burundi. Would he entrust the council with an independent investigation into, for example, the behaviour of British soldiers in Iraq? I am pretty sure that I know what his answer will be.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, the noble Baroness points to Item 7 of the Human Rights Council, concerning various resolutions relating to Israel and the Occupied Palestinian Territories. The Government have made their position clear to members of the Human Rights Council and to the Palestinians and the Israelis—that we want to see any bias in the Human Rights Council agenda addressed directly. That is what we have sought to do in the last few years, and the votes that we have taken have reflected that. Let me say again that, while we have reservations, we continue to be an active member of the Human Rights Council and we are supportive of its actions. Most recently, there were special sessions concerning a call for action on the plight of the Rohingya Muslims in Burma, and the Government have been supportive of those efforts. In any investigation that is held, impartiality and independence are important, as is balance, which is why the Government abstained.

Israel-Palestine Conflict

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Tuesday 27th March 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I reassure the noble Lord that I speak for Her Majesty’s Government, and the Government remain committed to a two-state solution and to UNRWA. Regarding the relationship with the United States, we continue to implore the United States, which is a key player in finding a lasting Middle East settlement, to engage fully with all parties and to continue engagement with both the Palestinians and the Israelis in finding a resolution to this crisis, which, as the noble Baroness has said, has gone on for far too long. In response to the question about specific meetings, most recently my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary has had discussions on a range of issues relating to foreign policy with American counterparts, and we continue to do so.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

My Lords, does the Minister agree with me that this is a problem that need not exist? Of the 60 million refugees in the world, only the Palestinians are treated as refugees for generation after generation, when they should have been resettled in the lands where they are living now, as were the same number of Jews who were expelled from the Middle East in the late 1940s. It is time to call a halt to this artificial definition, which is destined to use people as bargaining chips.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

The one point on which I will agree with the noble Baroness is that it is important to find a resolution to this long-standing issue. The Palestinians, as the Jewish communities of Israel before them, have suffered for too long from being disassociated and removed from the holy lands. We need to find a lasting solution that is fair for both the Palestinian people and of course Israel.

Disabled People: Employment

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Wednesday 30th November 2016 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Deech]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government, in the light of the Work, Health and Disability Green Paper, what steps they are taking to ensure that local authorities use their powers to remove the barriers that stop disabled people getting to work.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Transport (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, local authorities are required to have due regard to the need to eliminate discrimination, advance equality of opportunity and foster good relations under Section 149(1) of the Equality Act 2010. In relation to the transport barriers that can hinder disabled people getting to work, this Government are committed to ensuring that disabled people have the same access to transport and opportunities to travel as everyone else.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

My Lords, it is not enough to be committed. The Green Paper sets out complicated inducements and a target for reducing disability unemployment which is for ever receding into the distance. Right now, the Government could require local authorities to, for example, mandate disability training for bus and taxi drivers and have a certain percentage of accessible taxis available for disabled people. They could make sure that local authorities revoke licences where taxi drivers will not take guide dogs. These simple issues will enable people to get to work.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, the Government are taking action, as those who participated in—for example—the recent Bus Services Bill will have witnessed. Practical actions are being taken on improving accessibility for disabled people, and that Bill, which has left your Lordships’ House, will initiate a very practical programme of changes. The noble Baroness is right to raise the important issue of accessibility in taxis. In the country as a whole, only 56% of taxis are accessible, but the Government are looking at specific schemes, including one in Birmingham which provides the kind of training she alluded to. On the issue of those refusing access to the disabled or to those who require guide dogs, the Government are specifically looking at Sections 165 and 167 of the Equality Act. We will consider this very carefully and consult on the guidance to ensure that anyone who discriminates in this way against disabled people is covered. We will look at sanctions under the law, including making it a criminal offence.

Hate Crime

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Wednesday 29th June 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, the noble Lord makes some powerful points. First, let me assure him that, when it comes to dealing with the issue of hate crime, there is no void in leadership—and not just within the Government. Of course, the Government facilitate and demonstrate their intent. My right honourable friend the Home Secretary has been instrumental in some of the initiatives that I have already talked about. I am sure noble Lords will agree that she is not someone who shies away from difficult and tough calls. She has protected certain police budgets, but at the same time she has been at the forefront of providing the kind of protection and policies that we are seeing coming to the fore. I also pay tribute to my right honourable friend the Prime Minister. When we took up the mantle of new government, I spoke to him about tackling hate crime, particularly within certain religious communities, and ensuring that the fund for the protection of places of worship is instrumental and reflects this.

The noble Lord talked about those who play on the fear of immigration. I have already made my views clear on that. Anyone who plays on these fears to divide society needs to take a long, hard look at themselves.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

My Lords, first, I express my appreciation to the Minister for his long-standing, staunch attacks on prejudice. He has been excellent in this regard. Secondly, I agree with the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, that one should take a broader view of this. It would be wrong, and we would be burying our heads in the sand, if we thought it was simply the EU and immigration unleashing racism in this country. Sadly, as many of us know, there have been a growing number of attacks for decades on Muslims, for which Tell MAMA can provide the statistics, and on Jews. The Community Security Trust too, of which I am a patron, has statistics. Unfortunately, they spike when there is an incident such as Gaza, but I do not want to go there now. We must ask ourselves: whence comes this racism, which has gone on for so very long? It is not a new phenomenon from last week, although obviously one appreciates the vigour of the condemnation from the noble Lord, Lord Rosser, now that it has happened and been brought to our attention in a wider way.

I simply ask the Minister not to forget the forthcoming report of the Chakrabarti inquiry looking into anti-Semitism in the Labour Party, and the as yet unpublished report from the noble Baroness, Lady Royall—on incidents in the Oxford University Labour Club, I am ashamed to say. All these incidents must be taken on board; it is not a narrow phenomenon of the EU and immigration. I do not know whether the Minister will agree with me, but I suggest that one possible theory is segregated education and that university authorities have not been cracking down in the way they should have on the continuation of some of the prejudices, which I fear have been nurtured in segregated education. I do not mean just in regular schooling but unfortunately after school as well.

Anti-Semitism

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Tuesday 29th July 2014 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I have already said—and I say again to the noble Lord—that irrespective of what is happening in the Middle East, there is no place for anti-Semitic behaviour, particularly when it is translated into action of a despicable kind against any community, including the Jewish community specifically. We have to be absolutely clear. Things happen around the world. As to what is happening in Israel and Gaza, we all deplore the loss of civilian life, the tragedy and the humanitarian crisis taking place on the ground. Let me be absolutely clear and perhaps put it into context as a Muslim. The Islamic faith is clear: in such situations you shall protect churches, cloisters, synagogues and all innocent life. That is the kind of message that needs to resonate, not just in this House but throughout the country.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

My Lords, does the Minister recall that a year ago, after the beheading of Lee Rigby, the Prime Minister rushed forward to say that Islam was a religion of peace and that Islamophobia must be prevented; and the police made arrests in relation to tweets and demonstrations? Unfortunately, politicians have been in the forefront of making this link between Gaza, anti-Semitism, Hitler and all the rest of it. Will the noble Lord remind the House that the politicians should take the lead in calming down feelings, and that the police should be encouraged to prosecute where appropriate?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I totally agree with sentiments expressed by the noble Baroness. I am sure that we all recognise that we live in a multireligious society, and it is entirely appropriate that the House takes this opportunity to wish the Muslim community a very happy Eid Mubarak.

Crime and Courts Bill [HL]

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Tuesday 4th December 2012 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Deech]

My Lords, I rise to speak to Amendments 108AA and 122AA.

In brief, these amendments seeks to transfer the jurisdiction for appeals by barristers—or in some cases the Bar Standards Board—against certain disciplinary matters from the visitors to the Inns of Court to the High Court. The transfer of the visitors’ jurisdiction is something that the senior judiciary and the Bar Standards Board have been working towards for a number of years. We welcome an opportunity to get this into the law. I trust that the Government will accept these amendments.

The background is that judges have long exercised an appellate jurisdiction in relation to the regulation of barristers. Since 1873, judges of the High Court have been exercising this function as part of their so-called extraordinary functions in their capacity as visitors to the Inns of Court. In exercising this jurisdiction, the law being applied is derived from the constitution of the General Council of the Bar and the Inns of Court to which all barristers subscribe.

For some time, the Bar Standards Board has been in discussions with the judiciary about transferring the jurisdiction formally to the High Court. The current system is anachronistic and there is general agreement that it should be updated. As these appeals are already heard by High Court judges, the main impact of the change would be to enable these cases to be dealt with in the usual manner via the normal list in the Administrative Court. This is consistent with the disciplinary arrangements for solicitors and would save time and administrative burden for the courts service.

The clause was previously included in the draft Civil Law Reform Bill in the previous Parliament, but it was unable to be proceeded with for lack of time. This is why I hope the Government will now accept it. I beg to move.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, as the noble Baroness, Lady Deech, has explained this new clause abolishes the jurisdiction for High Court judges to sit as visitors to the Inns of Court and confers on the Bar Council and the Inns of Court the power to confer rights of appeal to the High Court in relation to the matters that were covered by the visitors’ jurisdiction.

The Government agree with the noble Baroness that the practice of High Court judges sitting as visitors to the Inns of Court is inappropriate. The new clause does not itself abolish appeals to visitors or automatically create a right of appeal to the High Court; it is for the Bar Council, the Inns of Court and their regulatory bodies to determine any new arrangements in this respect. However, once the clause is commenced, the practice of High Court judges sitting as visitors in exercise of their extraordinary functions as judges would cease. This is achieved by repealing Section 44 of the Senior Courts Act 1981 in so far as it confers jurisdiction on High Court judges to sit as visitors to the Inns of Court and enabling instead a right of appeal to be conferred to the High Court for barristers and those wishing to become barristers.

The role of judges as visitors is long-standing but somewhat opaque. Repealing the current jurisdiction and conferring express powers to create rights of appeal in respect of the relevant decisions is preferable because it promotes clarity and certainty, which are rightly the aims of modern law.

As the noble Baroness, Lady Deech, has proposed, the power to confer rights of appeal to the High Court would be available in relation to all matters in respect of which the visitors currently have jurisdiction. Under the current regulatory arrangements of the Bar Council, the visitors’ jurisdiction includes disciplinary decisions of the Council of the Inns of Court and decisions taken by the Bar Council’s Qualifications Committee. It would also include disputes between Inns and their members, or those wishing to become members, in recognition that historically the visitors’ jurisdiction extended to appeals from all decisions relating to the conduct of an Inn’s affairs. Abolishing the role of judges sitting as visitors is supported by the Lord Chief Justice, the Bar Standards Board, the General Council of the Bar and the Inns of Court. Enabling appeal to the High Court instead will improve administrative efficiency and transparency, and at the same time make the appeal arrangements for barristers more consistent with those for solicitors. I am therefore grateful to the noble Baroness for bringing this matter before the House and the Government are happy to support the amendment.

Legal Profession: Regulation

Debate between Baroness Deech and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Monday 3rd December 2012 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, I begin by thanking the noble Baroness, Lady Deech, for securing this debate. The excellence of the UK’s legal profession is well recognised worldwide, and rightly so. The regulatory framework is a key factor in ensuring that these high standards are maintained. I would add—looking towards the noble and learned Lord, Lord Goldsmith—that we meet once again at a late hour. However, the quality rather than the quantity of speakers is an important issue when it comes to the legal profession.

Before addressing many of the interesting points made by the noble Baroness and other noble Lords, I would like to talk briefly about the regulatory framework for lawyers in England and Wales and the reforms introduced in the Legal Services Act 2007. I would simply highlight, as the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, so rightly said, some of the positive elements that we have seen, accepting the challenges that we have faced since the introduction of the Legal Services Act. When we talk about regulation, let me assure you that, as someone who spent 20 years in the City of London and in financial services, the word “regulation” resonates quite loudly in my ears.

The Legal Services Act 2007 had three key aims: a more effective and simplified regulatory framework; a more effective and independent complaints-handling system; and more effective competition within legal services. I turn to the first of those. In January 2010 we saw the new regulatory framework become operational, with the Legal Services Board—which several noble Lords have mentioned this evening—getting up and running. The role of the Legal Services Board is set out in statute. It is an independent body providing—this is the crucial word—oversight regulation of the frontline approved regulators. The approved regulators remain responsible for the day-to-day regulation of their members unless, of course, they are found to be failing in their regulatory duties, in which case the Legal Services Board has a number of powers to intervene to ensure that effective regulation is maintained.

The second key reform is the creation of the Office for Legal Complaints which administers the Legal Ombudsman scheme. Last year it dealt with over 80,000 inquiries, and of those some 7,455, close to 10%, were directly resolved. It acts as the single point of contact for consumers unhappy with the service they have been provided by a lawyer. I would add that there is an informal resolution procedure which sees around 35% of cases handled in this way.

The third and final key reform is the new alternative business structures regime which allows different types of lawyers to work together with other professionals and to accept external investment and ownership. This should allow them to explore new ways of structuring their businesses to be more cost-effective, efficient and innovative. We hope that it will lead to more choice, improved standards and more competitive costs for consumers. While we are happy to see a diverse range of alternative business structures emerging, we are not saying that you need to be an alternative business structure; we are saying that we have given you the flexibility to practise as a sole practitioner, traditional law firm or alternative business structure. So far, over 40 firms have taken the opportunity to become alternative business structures, and it is particularly encouraging to see the diversity of firms involved, ranging from a simple husband and wife partnership to the Co-op.

So much change in such a short space of time means that this has been a steep learning curve for all involved, and this has inevitably led to challenges which several noble Lords have talked about in the debate. Let me address first the issue of proportionate regulation. My noble friends Lord Gold, Lord Faulks and Lord Phillips all alluded to it in their contributions. What is important is that the Legal Services Board and the approved regulators work together constructively to ensure that regulation is proportionate, ensures that consumers receive excellent standards of service, and that the opportunities provided by the Act in terms of competition and innovation are realised. Indeed, the issue of being proportionate to the role of the Legal Services Board was a point well made by the noble Baroness, Lady Deech. The Legal Services Board has been one of the key drivers of the reforms, partly driven by its statutory duties. I appreciate that the pace over the past two years has meant that, as with most new frameworks, there has been a lot of consultation and change, and while the benefits of all of these changes have yet to be realised, we are well on our way to seeing the more competitive and innovative sector that the Legal Services Act first envisaged.

My noble friend Lord Phillips talked about the eight objectives and said that he was not sure whether his contribution was going to be coherent and clear. I can assure my noble friend that he certainly was both coherent and clear. Perhaps I may draw his attention to one of the objectives, which is,

“to promote and maintain adherence to professional principles”,

which are defined in subsection (3)(a) as,

“that authorised persons should act with independence and integrity”.

The complexity of regulation is always an issue, and a key part of the new framework has been the separation of representative and regulatory functions as required by the Act. This led to the introduction of new bodies in addition to the Legal Services Board, the Solicitors Regulation Authority and the Bar Standards Board, which in turn has led to a comment made by several noble Lords that the new framework, rather than simplifying things, has actually added to the complexity. It is vital that consumers have confidence in the legal profession. To that end, regulation of the profession should be effective and not unduly influenced by its representative role. Without that, there is the risk of accusations of lawyers protecting their own. So while we have seen new regulatory arms emerging, that has been an important step in maintaining—that word again—the integrity of the profession. Also, before the new regime was established, a number of different organisations were involved in the regulation of the profession. While I take the point made by the noble Baroness, Lady Deech, about self-regulation, there was still some oversight. My noble friend Lord Phillips of Sudbury also mentioned this point. The Lord Chancellor used to approve rule changes, and in some cases rule changes had to be approved not only by the Lord Chancellor, but by other bodies, leading to the criticism that the length of time taken to process such changes was unduly long.

The new regime streamlines this system by making all rule changes the responsibility of the Legal Services Board. Rule change applications must be dealt with in a timely manner and the Legal Services Board has the power to exempt certain rule changes, fast track rule changes and in more complex changes seek additional views. The latter is not aimed at redoing the work of the approved regulator, but rather at looking at the changes objectively and providing helpful and constructive feedback.

[Baroness Deech]

I appreciate what the Minister says, but he must accept that there is need to investigate this. Rule changes now go through an even more tortuous process than was the case before. If the front-line regulators have responsibility, then their rule changes ought to be accepted without the imposition of ideology and various approaches which are not necessarily seen as the right way forward for a branch of the profession. Examining the way that rule changes are approved or held up is really important and I am not sure we can wait three years for that.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I thank the noble Baroness for her question and I agree with her. It is important that those in the profession contribute to the effectiveness of how these rule changes are implemented. I take on board what she says and I hope that some of the proposals we are putting forward will address the issues. I note the concerns expressed by my noble friend Lord Faulks and the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, about mission creep on the part of the Legal Services Board. As I said at the outset, the important issue is about the terms of reference: what was the Legal Services Board set up to do? Earlier this year, the Ministry of Justice conducted a triennial review of the Legal Services Board and the Office for Legal Complaints. Based on this, let me assure your Lordships that, on the responses received—including those from the approved regulators—the review concluded that, while it is still relatively early to assess the full impact of the Legal Services Board, its functions are still needed and should continue to be delivered in their current form.

This was a view supported by the Bar Standards Board and the Bar Council. We must remember that the Legal Services Board is independent of government and it is not for us to dictate how it operates. Its functions are clearly set out in the 2007 Act. However, it is clear that there has been a real need for an oversight regulator to drive the reforms set out in the Act. In doing so, it has fulfilled the important role that only an oversight regulator could have. Those who responded to the triennial review recognised the value it has brought. Following the feedback we have received, the chairman of the Legal Services Board wrote to the Ministry of Justice confirming that his board is also considering the responses made so far.

I am conscious of time, but turning to specific questions, my noble friend Lord Gold raised the issue of micromanagement and corporate governance. The Legal Services Board recognises that important challenges are emerging from the triennial review and accepts that there are things it needs to address. These will include more detail on its draft business plan for 2013-14, and proposals will include reviewing the approach to requests for changes to regulatory arrangements and designation processing, and refining the approach to research funding. Priorities will be included in the draft business plan. Increased understanding of the cost of regulation, not just the cost of the LSB but the full cost of practitioners, will also be looked at. A further issue was raised regarding the value for money of the Legal Services Board. Since the board became operational, it has recognised the need to keep its costs proportionate, and we have seen its running costs reduced year on year, from just over £5 million in 2009-10 to £4.5 million in 2011-12. The combined running costs of the Legal Services Board and the Office for Legal Complaints were approximately £22 million, somewhat less than the cost of the complaint handling regime that was previously in place.

Various issues and questions have been raised in terms of accountability and the post-legislative review. We are confident that for the here and now, the regulation of legal services is appropriate, but that does not mean it will remain so indefinitely. Given that the new regulatory framework was implemented only in 2010, we still believe that it is in its infancy. The next triennial review is due in 2015 and will provide another opportunity to assess how the regulatory framework is performing and whether the LSB’s functions are still needed in an evolved legal services market.

In conclusion, it is important to remember that the new regulatory regime and governance arrangements are still in their early stages, a point acknowledged by respondents to the triennial review. I assure the noble Baroness, Lady Deech, my noble friend Lord Faulks and other noble Lords that the Government are fully engaged with the legal profession and other interested parties in carrying out that triennial review. During that process, we not only conducted a call for evidence but held round-table events and one-to-one meetings. We will continue to engage openly with interested parties as part of that. I also assure noble Lords, including my noble and learned friend Lord Mackay, the noble and learned Lord, Lord Goldsmith, and my noble friend Lord Faulks, as well as the noble Baroness, that we will carry out post-legislative assessment of the Legal Services Act. That will look at the original aims of the reforms and how far we have come in implementing them, and we will be seeking further stakeholder views. Finally—