Lord Newby (LD)
My Lords, I remind the House that, in view of the large number of speakers in today’s debate, we have set a five-minute advisory time. I also advise the House that the G7 Statement will be repeated tomorrow after Oral Questions, rather than today. On these bases, it should be possible for the House to rise by 10 pm.
The Advocate-General for Scotland (Lord Wallace of Tankerness) (LD)
My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Rosser, for his encouragement regarding the tone I will set.
It is just over a week since the Motion for an humble Address was moved very eloquently and wittily by my noble friend Lord Fowler and was very ably seconded by my noble friend Lady Scott of Needham Market. The House has debated many issues since then. As has been pointed out by more than one contributor, today we are debating constitutional and devolved affairs, foreign and Commonwealth affairs, defence, international development and culture. My noble friend Lady Falkner said that it might have been better if those subjects had been taken on separate days, and I am strongly tempted to agree.
When I agreed to wind up this debate, I was told that it might focus very much on Scotland. There is another debate on Scotland planned for 24 June, to which I again have to respond. However, it is indeed a privilege to be able to respond to a debate which has ranged widely but has also included outstanding contributions from noble Lords who have such considerable expertise and knowledge in these areas.
It is probably also important to recognise some of the overlaps that are not immediately obvious. The Commonwealth Games were mentioned by my noble friends Lady Warsi and Lord Moynihan, and of course that links to the importance of the Commonwealth. It is one aspect of the Commonwealth where its nations and peoples come together and celebrate sport. The Games will also involve a considerable amount of work not only on the part of the Scottish Government but on the part of the United Kingdom Government in support for what we all very much hope will be a great feast of sport and a great success in Glasgow later this year.
My noble friend Lady Warsi also mentioned the importance of consular representation and talked about what we owe to our consular service throughout the world. She put it in the context of the many thousands of English supporters who will be travelling to Brazil. I very much regret that our consular officials in Brazil will not have to deal with Scottish supporters or indeed with Welsh and Northern Irish supporters. It is important that those of us who are arguing the case for Scotland remaining part of the United Kingdom should remind ourselves of the great service, advice and support that Scots travelling abroad get from a range of consular staff, as well as other Foreign and Commonwealth Office support, right across the globe.
It will be impossible for me to pick up every point, for which I apologise. However, I shall try to pick up some of the themes and, if particular issues have arisen, I shall write to noble Lords. My noble friend Lord Rodgers of Quarry Bank let me off the hook and said that he would accept a letter. I had actually anticipated being asked about English Heritage and had asked for briefing on it. However, the briefing had not anticipated the question that came from the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Norwich as to whether we can have a fast track for women bishops entering your Lordships’ House if, as we hope, the legislation is passed to allow women bishops in the Church of England. That would be a matter for the Government and the Church of England to discuss at the appropriate time.
The right reverend Prelate also raised the question of cathedrals. As he acknowledged, in the Budget in March it was announced that a two-year grant scheme will provide £20 million to help to carry out essential repairs to ensure that cathedrals are in a good condition, as they will play a central role in the First World War centenary commemorations.
On the subject of culture and sport, my noble friends Lady Bonham-Carter and Lady Benjamin mentioned the creative industries. Today, our agenda has been driven by the Creative Industries Council. It was originally set up by the Government but is now industry-led, and its role is to identify key barriers to growth for the sector and to propose actions both for the industry and for government to overcome. We are committed to working with the CIC as it develops and implements an industry-led growth strategy, building on its work to date. I understand that that strategy is due to be launched in the summer, and we will obviously want to reflect on it and respond to it.
I will write to my noble friend Lady Benjamin about tax credits for children’s programmes However, I very much take on board the point that she made about the importance of diversity in the media, particularly behind the scenes. It was a very well made point, and it is something not just for government but for the industry itself to reflect on.
Sport, particularly football, and governance were raised by the noble Lord, Lord Triesman. In a courageous speech, he rightly praised the investigative journalism that has gone on with regard to a number of serious allegations which will have to be properly addressed. Governance obviously is recognised to be primarily in the gift of the national governing bodies. We expect good governance of all national governing bodies, particularly for funded sport—including Sport England and the UK sport NGBs—in achieving this and in overseeing the investment of public funds.
The noble Lord, Lord Rosser, raised the BBC. We have just announced the process for appointing the next BBC Trust chair. Recruitment is under way. The post has been publicly advertised. The chair will be chosen on merit in a fair and open way. The noble Lord also mentioned the BBC World Service. It is fair to point out that the former chair of the trust, my noble friend Lord Patten, confirmed in a statement in June 2013 that the funding for 2014-15, which is the first year of licence fee funding, would be £245 million. That is an increase of £5 million on the previous year. He also stated that the move to licence fee funding would give the World Service a far greater degree of financial security.
In response to the noble Lord, Lord Grocott, it would probably save time if I do not give the huge list of things which the Government have achieved in terms of constitutional measures passed during this Parliament. He mentioned the Fixed-term Parliaments Act, as did my noble friend Lord Norton of Louth. I say to my noble friend who asked about the Government’s response that I very much apologise to the House that once again we have not been able to respond to the Constitution Committee’s report on the constitutional implications of coalition government. I had hoped that we would have been able to respond by today’s debate and regret that that has not been the case. As my noble friend indicated, it raises important matters which require detailed consideration and agreement. I hope that that response will come as soon as possible.
My noble friend Lord Tyler mentioned the recall Bill and emphasised the importance of getting the right balance. Those who represent their constituents and express their views, which may be unpopular, should not be at risk. But if people break the rules or commit a crime, we will put in place a means for a petition by their constituents.
The House will have been struck by the number of very considered contributions from those from Northern Ireland and from the noble Lord, Lord Dubs, who has considerable experience of the Province. Questions were asked about dealing with the past. It is certainly the Government’s view that they wish to remain engaged in the process but they very much recognise that the process must be led by the people and parties in Northern Ireland. We welcome the fact that the party leaders are resuming their meetings. The point was made in more than one contribution that we must ensure that confidence is not eroded. The noble Lord, Lord Empey, and others referred to the Haass talks. The Government and the Prime Minister take a close interest in this matter, which is very much at the heart of people and community groups in Northern Ireland.
I certainly will try to respond in writing about what has been happening as regards the royal prerogative of mercy. My right honourable friend answered Questions on Northern Ireland today and last month indicated that the records from 1987-97 would be looked at. I know that she wants to take that forward. My noble friend Lady Randerson, as the Northern Ireland Office’s spokesman in your Lordships’ House, certainly confirmed that we would be more than willing to arrange a briefing for Peers with an interest in Northern Ireland before the Summer Recess. The noble Baroness, Lady O’Loan, raised the issue of coroners. They probably merit more than I can answer in a very short time. I hope that noble Lords who raised issues about Northern Ireland will accept the Government’s keen and continuing interest in this. We recognise the sensitivities involved and will certainly want to engage with noble Lords who have a very understandable interest in what is going on there.
The noble and gallant Lord, Lord Stirrup, reflected on where we were 12 months ago and where we are today. It was a litany of crises that had magnified or new ones that have arisen. It was a very sombre but necessary reminder to us as to the uncertain world in which we live. His speech was certainly a very thought-provoking contribution to the debate. He obviously led on to argue the case for the importance of our defences, with military size and equipment being up to the challenges. That was echoed by the noble Lord, Lord West of Spithead, who particularly focused on the capacity of the Royal Navy. The Royal Navy remains one of the world’s premier navies. It has a bright future. We have shown our commitment to the Queen Elizabeth carriers and the Type 45s. Of the latter, the sixth, HMS “Duncan”, was commissioned last year. There are the Type 26 global combat ships, the Astute-class programme and the new offshore patrol vessels. Four new support tankers for the Royal Navy are being built and we also look forward to the Successor-class submarine programme. I know that there is more detailed concern about that; it was reflected in the debate.
A number of colleagues, including my noble friend Lord Lyell and the noble Lord, Lord West, called for a debate on this. Following the debate on 23 June—a week on Monday—on the defence legislation setting up the ombudsman, there will be a debate on the armed services when there will be an opportunity to deal with these issues more fully. My noble friend Lord Lyell asked about the future reserves. The expansion of the reserves is about doing defence differently, not about doing it on the cheap. Our recruitment campaign is a five-year programme. We are confident that we can meet our target of 35,000 trained reservists by 2018. It was never the intention that the bulk of these would be recruited in the first year.
One of the themes that ran through our debate today is the Global Summit to End Sexual Violence in Conflict. It was interesting that in a number of areas where issues of crisis and conflict arose they were also linked to issues involving sexual violence. The Government welcome and are grateful for the tributes paid not least to my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary for hosting the summit. We heard from the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Coventry. My noble friend Lady Williams of Crosby made a very important point about the extent to which sexual violence against women and young people is now used almost as an instrument of war. That was reflected in the contribution from the noble Baroness, Lady Cox, who gave specific examples. The noble Baroness, Lady Kidron, in a very powerful speech about events in Somalia, drove home the need for concern. It is absolutely vital that we address and counter this.
I think we all agree that identifying the problem is one thing and the next step is implementation. We very much hope that we will be able to start taking these matters forward. We note the challenges in many countries. Burma was mentioned, as were Somalia, northern Nigeria, Syria and Sudan. It is because women and girls are more likely to be poorer, more marginal and with fewer rights that DfID puts them front and centre. The right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Coventry talked of the need to address social norms to counter violence against women and girls. That is very true and underpins the work that my honourable friend Lynne Featherstone has done in challenging and combating female genital mutilation. A number of practical outcomes—I will not list them all—are sought as a result of this global summit. The noble Lord, Lord Ahmed, referred to the violence in Kashmir but, with particular reference to Nigeria and Boko Haram, the Foreign Secretary will be hosting a summit tomorrow, 12 June, to facilitate regional co-ordination in the fight generally against Boko Haram. That is another welcome initiative by my right honourable friend.
I thank noble Lords for their tributes to the United Kingdom for finally reaching the milestone of contributing 0.7% of GNI to aid. As to what the noble Baroness, Lady Kidron, said about her work in Somalia and what the noble Lord, Lord Ahmed, said in relation to health and education in Pakistan, I can assure them that all contracts are awarded strictly in accordance with extremely tight protocols. As the noble Lord, Lord Collins, said, it is right that we assist. It makes sense for the UK to help in encouraging stability and growth around the world. I associate myself with the remarks of the noble Earl, Lord Sandwich, in paying tribute to aid workers. It is important that we recognise the contribution they make, very often in the front line.
My noble friend Lord Chidgey challenges our thinking on the private sector and we shall be responding to the ACI review shortly. We are already addressing its concerns. I hear what he says about the key importance of encouraging the development of parliaments so that they can hold governments to account. The rule of law, transparency and respect for human rights are also vital for a flourishing democracy, as a number of noble Lords have said.
The noble Earl, Lord Sandwich, raised the issue of data collection. We agree that there needs to be such a data revolution as information enables us to ensure that no one is left behind. That theme was also reflected in the contributions of the noble Lords, Lord Low, Lord Hunt and Lord Crisp, in relation to those with disabilities. DfID will be shortly responding to the International Development Select Committee’s report in this area. I recognise also the point made by my noble friend Lord Loomba that widows suffer a double discrimination both as women and as widows. He has a formidable record in championing them.
We recognise, too, that climate change affects the poorest the most. It was therefore important to have the contributions of the noble Lords, Lord Prescott, Lord Hunt and Lord Collins, about the vital importance of reaching global agreement on climate change. We will seek to take that forward across different departments in government in the various discussions and negotiations that lie ahead.
On Ukraine, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Hannay, for his comments and I can assure him that the situation will remain a priority. We are, as a Government, committed to supporting President Poroshenko and his efforts to tackle the challenges facing Ukraine. The noble Lord, Lord Kerr of Kinlochard, mentioned the Austrian state treaty. The bright young men and women in the Box have not yet come up with a specific answer but I shall make sure that he gets one. He asked about our strategy beyond sanctions. We continue to work in close co-ordination with our European Union and other international partners to de-escalate the situation in Ukraine and to help support the Government of Ukraine and President Poroshenko in delivering the stable, democratic and prosperous future that the Ukrainian people deserve.
We played a key role in ensuring that Ukraine had the support it needed to hold free and fair elections on 21 May. I welcome the contribution of the noble Lord, Lord Cromwell, in what may or may not have been a maiden speech. He is welcomed back for the assistance that he and his company have given in that.
In partnership with Ukraine and the United States we hosted the Ukraine asset recovery forum in April in London in order to co-ordinate the next steps. We are providing up to £10 million in technical assistance. Plans include the World Bank Trust Fund, partnership with Germany, public financial management, managed funds for technical assistance and support to elections. There are a number of strands to this.
As to the relationship with President Putin, a point raised by a number of your Lordships, EU heads of state and government agreed on 20 March that relationships with Russia could not simply be business as usual. The Prime Minister and the Foreign Secretary have spoken to both President Putin and Foreign Minister Lavrov respectively during this crisis. As has been indicated, the Prime Minister met President Putin on 5 June and reaffirmed that the status quo is unacceptable and that the continuing destabilisation of eastern Ukraine must stop. President Putin must recognise the legitimate election of President Poroshenko and stop arms crossing the border into Ukraine. I think it was my noble friend Lord Jopling who asked about NATO in this context. The House will be well aware that NATO’s response to an attack is governed by Article 5 of the Washington treaty, but noble Lords will be aware of activity that NATO has been undertaking in some of the Baltic member states.
Clearly the issues in the Middle East—I think it was said from Mali to Mumbai—are of vital importance. Picking up a point raised by the noble Lord, Lord Hylton, on 2 June, President Abbas announced the formation of an interim technocratic Government, who the United Kingdom and others have welcomed, reuniting Gaza and the West Bank under a Government who are committed to peace. That, we believe, is a necessary condition for resolving the Israel/Palestinian conflict. It is very much in the long-term interests of Israel and of peace in the whole region for the two states to embrace a two-state solution, as I believe the alternatives to that would be much more difficult. The noble Lord, Lord Williams of Baglan, expressed from his own rich experience his concerns about these matters. He also asked about Egypt. We believe that inclusive political participation is essential in Egypt and that President al-Sisi needs to ensure that Egypt’s constitution allows for it. The noble Lord, Lord Stone of Blackheath, told us about MECCI going off to Egypt this weekend. The Government welcome MECCI’s endeavours to strengthen parliamentary links between the United Kingdom and Egypt, and efforts to build accountable and democratic institutions. I will be interested to hear about the visit, and no doubt the noble Lord will report back to your Lordships’ House on his return.
It is clear that the events of the past 24 hours in Mosul underline the difficulties and the sensitivities. As the Foreign Secretary has indicated, they show the impact of Syria on the entire region and emphasise the need to renew efforts to find a political solution in Syria. It is also important for a new Government to be formed to ensure political unity in Iraq and to tackle terrorism. I would urge all Iraqis to unite. These are developing issues, but I can assure the House that my colleagues in the Foreign and Commonwealth Office will monitor them very closely. The right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Coventry asked if the Friends of Syria Group could do more to prevent fracturing of the Syrian opposition and what the international community could do. It is important to recognise that the United Kingdom has driven international efforts to find political solutions to the crisis. At its request, we have provided political and practical support to help the opposition national coalition become a credible and unified body capable of engaging in the political process, and through the Friends of Syria core group, we have encouraged the national coalition to reach out to all sections of Syrian society and demonstrate that it is a credible alternative to the Assad regime. We will continue to work with our London 11 allies and the national coalition to strengthen it further.
Before moving on to Scotland, I have a final issue to raise on foreign affairs, but first I must respond to my noble friend about the structure of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office. I think that her points are well made and well understood, and I understand that efforts are being made to increase the number of women in senior ambassadorial and high commission positions. Perhaps I may write to her in more detail because her argument was well made and well received.
I turn to the issue of European Union reform. I do not think that we should be trapped into setting out a list that the media would then treat as a set of red lines. It is important to look at the direction of the European Union. It was right of my noble friends Lord Ashdown and Lord Alderdice to remind us of the origins of the European Union only a few days after we marked the 70th anniversary of the D-day landings, when Europe was liberated from the tyranny of Nazism. The vision of the initial pioneers was to create a Europe that would not be at war, as it was for my father’s and grandfather’s generations, but would be at peace. We want to ensure that we have a European Union that is competitive, flexible and democratically accountable. We are working with our partners to try to achieve that objective, and we should not underestimate what we have done so far. We have delivered the first ever cut in the budget of the European Union. We have launched negotiations on the world’s biggest trade deal. I would say to the noble Lord, Lord Hannay, who raised the matter, that it is still very much part of the United Kingdom’s priorities to have an EU-US trade deal. It would be worth £10 billion a year to the United Kingdom economy. We have safeguarded British interests by keeping the United Kingdom out of the eurozone bailout facility. Lastly, as someone who represented a fishing constituency for many years, the progress I have seen in the development of the common fisheries policy over recent months and years is right and proper, but I never thought that I would see the day that it happened.
Finally, the issue of Scotland has been raised by many contributors. The speech of the noble Lord, Lord Reid of Cardowan, who was the first person to speak principally on Scotland in this debate, was one that struck us all. He reminded us of the tone of the campaign. The noble Baroness, Lady Liddell of Coatdyke, and my noble friend Lord Stephen also referred to the response on the Twittersphere to JK Rowling’s announcement. I was worried when the noble Baroness said that she was going to quote something because I had seen some of the responses. She was right: the ones that she and my noble friend quoted are by far the least offensive. It is language that would shock us all. It is not just the tone of the debate—important issues about the referendum get lowered by that—but my fear is what kind of Scotland would it be if people like that got their way? It is not one that I would feel comfortable in, where if you do not agree you are subject to such denigration. Those who have said it is important that the First Minister should clearly distance himself from that are absolutely right.
The noble Lord, Lord Hennessy, said that we should be looking to a new United Kingdom in the event of a no vote. As I indicated, my right honourable friend the Secretary of State for Scotland has already indicated that he would be looking to convene a new Scotland because we already have a number of contributions from the political parties. I think it was the noble Baroness, Lady Liddell, who talked about the constitutional convention. That was important but none of the projects that has come forward so far for Scottish devolution, either the 1998 Act or the 2012 Act, came originally from government. The convention, which embraced civic Scotland, led to the 1998 Act, and the 2012 Act was a product of the Calman commission, which again was not a product of government but of parties and people in civic Scotland. It is important that we engage civic Scotland.
However, I also take the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Hennessy, about the wider United Kingdom. The noble Lord, Lord Whitty, talked about decentralisation, and colleagues from Wales and Northern Ireland have contributed as well as those from England. Indeed, in replying to a letter some time ago from the First Minister of Wales about a constitutional convention embracing the whole United Kingdom, my right honourable friend the Prime Minister indicated—I do not have his exact words—that there was some merit in that but not until we had actually done the most important thing of making sure that we still had a proper United Kingdom with Scotland as part of it.
I want to conclude with this thought. We have talked about the number of things that have been achieved. The noble Lord, Lord Reid, used the “Monty Python” sketch to illustrate them. But many of the things that have been relevant to this debate are relevant to why Scotland should remain part of the United Kingdom—not least the global summit aimed at preventing violence against women in conflict, which is something that the United Kingdom can proudly claim to have been at the forefront of leading. The noble Lord, Lord Judd, is absolutely right to stress the importance of human rights values in our foreign policy. I think that an independent Scotland would still aspire to these values but it would not have the clout or the influence to do as much about it as we can as part of the United Kingdom.
I think it was the noble Lord, Lord Wigley, who said that we cannot have Scotland’s voice always filtered through London but that is not the point. The point is that Britain’s voice is very often in a Scots accent—or a Welsh accent or a Northern Irish accent—as much as an English accent. It is that greater thing that we aspire to, things that we do not just historically—and reference has been made to the historic events of 100 years ago and 70 years ago—but today, such as preventing violence against women or the arms trade treaty, which again we took leadership of, which we can be proud of as a United Kingdom and in which Scots have played their part. That is why I sincerely believe that on 18 September my country men and women in Scotland will vote to ensure that we are kept together, and that when we have the Queen’s Speech next year, whoever is doing the arrangements will ensure that Scotland still comes under constitutional and devolved affairs and not foreign affairs. I ask the House to support the Motion.